Posts Against The Church Or Misleading

[Heather]

From now on I will just start deleting them. I refuse to run an LDS based site which allows others to post topics and comments which bash and run down LDS beliefs. If you come across any such posts, please use the "report this post." I feel there are millions of other message boards out there, and it's not right if someone is coming to this board seeking advice from other LDS members, only to be bombarded with contrary and contrasting views.

I feel that if someone is posting on this board it is because they are seeking advice relevant to the LDS church teachings. Else they would be posting advice on any one of the other million boards across the net.

I will be making new monitors to help keep control of the topics, and allowing them to deleting anything that is misleading and false. I don't want to sound narrow minded, but allowing this kind of bashing to go on hurts the site and causes people to leave. If you would like me to create a separate forum for other christian beliefs (no anti / bashing) I would be willing to do that.

[begood2]

Heather,

I think that the new policy is great! I have only been a member of the church since late 2000. I joined the LDS talk forum as another source of quality, character building, LDS beliefs sharing and understandings.

I came here in search of a greater understanding of my church and as a helping hand, if I were having trouble maintaining the high standards that God expects of us.

I felt that having an association with LDS members who are also struggling with everyday life while trying to perfect their beliefs and actions so that they might be worthy of the great blessings that God will share with us .... would be a common ground upon which we could give each other strength and encouragement.

If I wanted to read and write about church bashing ... then I would visit the anti- sites. No thank you! By the way john doe said something similar about three months ago with little support given to him.

[DisRuptive1]

What if a gay Latter Day Saint comes for advice. According to how you want us to act, you'll want us to bash him to kingdom come since gayness is against church beliefs. Is that right?

[begood2]

Originally posted by DisRuptive1@Sep 19 2005, 06:29 PM

What if a gay Latter Day Saint comes for advice.  According to how you want us to act, you'll want us to bash him to kingdom come since gayness is against church beliefs.  Is that right?

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I personally don't understand same sex attraction, but:

I don't think that we need to bash anyone. I would however refer the individual to the Fair web site which has some excellent articles that address same sex attraction. That person could then, either take or leave the advice ... I wouldn't try to cram it down their throat however.

http://www.fairlds.org/

[Heather]

The church teaches love the sinner and not the sin. It's not right to bash, judge, or condemn anyone for any reason. At the same time, I wouldn't promote the site saying, "It's okay." Instead I would say the church does not believe anyone is gay, but that there are those who have homosexual tendencies, and acting on those tendencies is a sin. However, that does not make you a bad person and it doesn't make God or Christ hate you.

[Jason]

Is posting your opinion considered "against the church"?

To my knowledge (one specific poster aside) nobody's accused me of posting anything "anti", and to my knowledge I've not said anything that specifically targets the LDS church.

I have a great respect for the LDS church. I love it's people, and am proud to call Latter-day Saints my neighbors and my family.

I think you should at least give a poster a chance to edit or discuss a post before wholesale deleting occurs.

My opinion.

Thanks.

[StrawberryFields]

Originally posted by Jason@Sep 19 2005, 08:32 PM

Is posting your opinion considered "against the church"? 

To my knowledge (one specific poster aside) nobody's accused me of posting anything "anti", and to my knowledge I've not said anything that specifically targets the LDS church. 

I have a great respect for the LDS church.  I love it's people, and am proud to call Latter-day Saints my neighbors and my family. 

I think you should at least give a poster a chance to edit or discuss a post before wholesale deleting occurs. 

My opinion. 

Thanks.

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Jason,

Just my thoughts here okay?

This is an LDS message board and I don't like it when someone questions the divinity of my Savior. I don't like to see things I consider to be sacred (things of the temple) smeared over a LDS message board.

I have seen you make some good efforts to not offend but I have also seen some things posted on an LDS message board that I don't think belongs here. Many of us know you therefore we care about you. We have new LDS Talk members that don't know anything about you and your "tone" could appear anti.

You are posting on an LDS message board and you should know what will offend and what will not offend.

[Jason]

Originally posted by Strawberry Fields@Sep 19 2005, 08:47 PM

Jason,

Just my thoughts here okay?

This is an LDS message board and I don't like it when someone questions the divinity of my Savior. I don't like to see things I consider to be sacred (things of the temple) smeared over a LDS message board.

I have seen you make some good efforts to not offend but I have also seen some things posted on an LDS message board that I don't think belongs here. Many of us know you therefore we care about you. We have new LDS Talk members that don't know anything about you and your "tone" could appear anti.

You are posting on an LDS message board and you should know what will offend and what will not offend.

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Ok, the "Is Jesus real" thread maybe construed as "anti", but it's a very broad anti since im not specifically targeting the LDS church, but all of Christendom.

Delete it if you must.

But the Temple discussion is only about the source of the ceremony, and is neither for nor against it. LDS apologists speak more specifically about it than I have, so I don't really think you can call it anti.

Unless you're going to tell me that the actual, historical truth about the signs and tokes is "anti"?

[StrawberryFields]

Originally posted by Jason+Sep 19 2005, 09:34 PM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-Strawberry Fields@Sep 19 2005, 08:47 PM

Jason,

Just my thoughts here okay?

This is an LDS message board and I don't like it when someone questions the divinity of my Savior. I don't like to see things I consider to be sacred (things of the temple) smeared over a LDS message board.

I have seen you make some good efforts to not offend but I have also seen some things posted on an LDS message board that I don't think belongs here. Many of us know you therefore we care about you. We have new LDS Talk members that don't know anything about you and your "tone" could appear anti.

You are posting on an LDS message board and you should know what will offend and what will not offend.

←

Ok, the "Is Jesus real" thread maybe construed as "anti", but it's a very broad anti since im not specifically targeting the LDS church, but all of Christendom.

Delete it if you must.

But the Temple discussion is only about the source of the ceremony, and is neither for nor against it. LDS apologists speak more specifically about it than I have, so I don't really think you can call it anti.

Unless you're going to tell me that the actual, historical truth about the signs and tokes is "anti"?

←

Sent a PM

[Heather]

I have the board setup so when anything is deleted, it goes to a forum only Spencer and I can see. So if you feel your post was unjustly removed, just pm/email me, and let me know the topic it was in, and I will check it out.

[DisRuptive1]

Look, I've been to numerous forums and probably banned from half of them. But I know what kills a forum and censorship is one of them. If everyone is in agreement with everyone else, you end up getting just a whole bunch of butt patting in forums, better known as spam. (Oh that was a great thought.) With no aposing viewpoints there can be no arguments. If there are no arguments, threads will be no longer than a page and on the first page of that thread will basicly be agreements of the first poster's opinion.

Censorship also limits the amount of new posts going up (since people are afraid of spending work to put down their opinion only to have it deleted) and this board doesn't seem to recieve enough traffic to deal with also deleting a bunch of threads. And you can't deny the fact that if people aren't interested in posting replys to supposedly anti- material, then it would quickly fall to the bottom of recent posts and quickly get put back a few pages where most people won't go.

What I see overall happening here is that some of the posts that a lot of people get involved in, in fact posts that most of the active members get involved in, are going to be deleted. It won't be all of them, maybe say, only 10% (because who friggen' cares about a painted rock), then the board is going to suffer. It might not show at first, but I'm sure the restrictions will mutate into something that will eventually destroy the board. Just my non-anti- opinion.

[Ray]

FYI, to be “anti” [something] is to be “opposed to” [something], or to be “anything other than accepting of” [something], so by making any insulting remarks about [something] you are showing that you are “not accepting” of [something], which shows that you are “anti” [something]

Or in other words, it’s perfectly acceptable to be inquisitive about something, or to ask as many questions as you want about something, but the moment you start “bashing” or “ridiculing” or “poking fun” at [something], you have then crossed the line that separates those who are "for" us and those who are “against” us.

And btw, LDS are “against” sin and wickedness, and Heather doesn’t have a problem with any of us stating that we are against sin and wickedness or which sins we are against, as long as we all show love for everyone.

And yes, it is possible to not agree with [something] a person does while still being able to love them, and not be offensive towards them, and all Heather has asked is that we [the members of LDSTalk] not be offensive to beliefs that LDS consider to be sacred.

[StrawberryFields]

Originally posted by DisRuptive1@Sep 20 2005, 11:48 AM

Look, I've been to numerous forums and probably banned from half of them.  But I know what kills a forum and censorship is one of them.  If everyone is in agreement with everyone else, you end up getting just a whole bunch of butt patting in forums, better known as spam. (Oh that was a great thought.)  With no aposing viewpoints there can be no arguments.  If there are no arguments, threads will be no longer than a page and on the first page of that thread will basicly be agreements of the first poster's opinion.

Censorship also limits the amount of new posts going up (since people are afraid of spending work to put down their opinion only to have it deleted) and this board doesn't seem to recieve enough traffic to deal with also deleting a bunch of threads.  And you can't deny the fact that if people aren't interested in posting replys to supposedly anti- material, then it would quickly fall to the bottom of recent posts and quickly get put back a few pages where most people won't go.

What I see overall happening here is that some of the posts that a lot of people get involved in, in fact posts that most of the active members get involved in, are going to be deleted.  It won't be all of them, maybe say, only 10% (because who friggen' cares about a painted rock), then the board is going to suffer.  It might not show at first, but I'm sure the restrictions will mutate into something that will eventually destroy the board.  Just my non-anti- opinion.

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Dis, it isn't the argue part that is in jeopardy here it is the lack of respect shown to the gospel and to the things that offend the majority of the members....certainly you know what respect is.

Oh and who cares about a painted rock that is a Tribute to America and those who serve our country? I would think that now when our world is in such a quandary we should all look for ways to find good even if it is shown beautifully on a rock.

[Jason]

Heather,

I believe that the best solution here is to set up a non-LDS forum. We can still be bound by LDSTALK rules, but we don't have to listen to certain posters whine about why we're here, and not somewhere else. (Reminds me of some LDS in Utah who complain about non-LDS moving into the State... )

You can take all the threads that don't seem quite what you're looking for here, and place them into the "Non-LDS" forum (Like my "Did Jesus even exist" thread).

You guys can avoid the forum and post your GA quotes to your hearts content, and those interested in debate may hang out at the "other" forum.

Don't forget, that by not banning the non-LDS, you maintain your board traffic. With the low numbers around here, you really should give that some consideration.

[Heather]

I'm actually not worried about numbers declining by moderating the board better. Most times I log on, there are 10+ people browsing, and 10+ new members every day, so i really don't feel threatened by that, considering that the majority of those coming to the site are indeed looking for an LDS site.

I have gone ahead an made an open forum where topics like this can be discussed. You can't view this forum unless you are a member and logged in. Moderators should move any topic in question to that forum. In the future I might make it so you have to join the forum to be able to view it, or if you don't want to see topics there, you can be placed in a different member group. (I guess depending on how popular the area is, on the number of individuals who don't want to read the topics there.

[DisRuptive1]

So anti- and hate stuff can go here now, or just borderline stuff?

[Jason]

Originally posted by Heather@Sep 20 2005, 09:46 PM

I'm actually not worried about numbers declining by moderating the board better.  Most times I log on, there are 10+ people browsing, and 10+ new members every day, so i really don't feel threatened by that, considering that the majority of those coming to the site are indeed looking for an LDS site.

I have gone ahead an made an open forum where topics like this can be discussed.  You can't view this forum unless you are a member and logged in.  Moderators should move any topic in question to that forum. In the future I might make it so you have to join the forum to be able to view it, or if you don't want to see topics there, you can be placed in a different member group. (I guess depending on how popular the area is, on the number of individuals who don't want to read the topics there.

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Where's the forum?

[Heather]

no bashing any church or person, but this is where you can discuss different view points. The point is so someone doesn't come in and ask a question about how a situation should be handled, and then gets confused as to which one is a church belief, because they're reading a bunch of view points.

Can you not see it on the forum list? Click on forums and go to the bottom.

http://www.ldstalk.com/forums/index.php?showforum=33

[Jason]

I can't see any such forum. Further, the link you provided gave me a broken link error.

[Jason]

Heather,

are you talking about the "Christian beliefs" board?

How about a simple "non-lds" board? Many of us here who are not LDS are not christian either!

[Heather]

try it now. I had the permissions wrong

[StrawberryFields]

Originally posted by Jason+Sep 19 2005, 09:34 PM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-Strawberry Fields@Sep 19 2005, 08:47 PM

Jason,

Just my thoughts here okay?

This is an LDS message board and I don't like it when someone questions the divinity of my Savior. I don't like to see things I consider to be sacred (things of the temple) smeared over a LDS message board.

I have seen you make some good efforts to not offend but I have also seen some things posted on an LDS message board that I don't think belongs here. Many of us know you therefore we care about you. We have new LDS Talk members that don't know anything about you and your "tone" could appear anti.

You are posting on an LDS message board and you should know what will offend and what will not offend.

←

Ok, the "Is Jesus real" thread maybe construed as "anti", but it's a very broad anti since im not specifically targeting the LDS church, but all of Christendom.

Delete it if you must.

But the Temple discussion is only about the source of the ceremony, and is neither for nor against it. LDS apologists speak more specifically about it than I have, so I don't really think you can call it anti.

Unless you're going to tell me that the actual, historical truth about the signs and tokes is "anti"?

←

I let the go with just a PM to you. Now I can see that it doesn't matter to you that you use words that I had never heard of before going to the temple for the first time. I personally don't talk about the things you say the LDS apologists speak openly about and I don't go to those sites either. I was taught years ago that these things a sacred and they were not to be discussed outside of the temple. I have watched you lead another member here into this conversation in another post.

Moderators, Am I out of line in my thinking that this should not be allowed? I need to know if it is okay to use these words in reference to the temple ceremony here, I am at a loss.

[Guest jyn2001]

i agree with you strawberry_fields, people should not be allowed to put the church down. i'm lds and love the church alot. my husband and i are planning to have a temple wedding one day and will have our daugther sealed to us too. can you give me any advise as to what the right temple dress would be for a wedding? hope to hear from you soon.

[StrawberryFields]

Originally posted by Soulsearcher@Sep 22 2005, 10:31 AM

While i understand the problems you have with Jason's postings about the temple ceremony, I'm not sure that action should be taken against him for open discussion about it.

The temple is one of the biggest mysteries for un non members.  If it is discussed here then you can control it, otherwise people go and look on other sites to satisfy their curiosity, and i know from experience that any site that explains the endowments is biased.

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That's just it SS, it is suppose to be held sacred. It was also a mystery to me until I went into the temple for the first time. Of course I went through a temple preparation class and I knew of the names of the ceremonies but that was about it. In the last past couple of years I did serve with my husband as a ward missionary. We were asked to be the escorts to a couple we helped to become ready to be sealed into the temple. Even on a one on one basis we could not tell them things such as Jason is able to discuss openly here.

[StrawberryFields]

Originally posted by jyn2001@Sep 22 2005, 10:08 AM

i agree with you strawberry_fields, people should not be allowed to put the church down.  i'm lds and love the church alot.  my husband and i are planning to have a temple wedding one day and will have our daugther sealed to us too.  can you give me any  advise as to what the right temple dress would be for a wedding? hope to hear from you soon.

←

How exciting for you and your family.

Let me do some research and see if I can find a website that sells something that would be appropriate for you to wear. We used to have link for them but I can't find them now. I need to go to work now but I will be back later to check for you.

.