Centered On Christ


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A friend of mine is starting up a corporation.  He intends this to be a very large corporation.  He brought me in to help out with some things.  He kept mentioning the core values of the company in a way that I didn't understand.  That is to say, he was using terminology that was kind of cryptic.

I asked for clarification.  As he explained, I began envisioning the concentric circles model of theology.  It was exactly what he was explaining as company values.  I proceeded to draw the concentric circles model using the values he described.  I showed it to him and began to explain what it meant.  He's an atheist, so the idea that it was somewhat related to theology was off-putting to him.  He ended up interrupting me before my explanation was through. He then suggested that I re-do the model because it didn't accurately depict what he wanted for the company.

He went on to describe a venn diagram of the values (explaining that my model was inaccurate) with the core values on the outside, instead of the concentric circles.  I told him that my model was not a venn diagram and it wasn't intended to be.  He claimed he understood.  But I don't think he did.  In the end he wanted me to re-do it as a venn diagram model with the core values as an all encompassing circle and the company name at the center to send to the graphic designer.  I did so.

Well, it's been just long enough for me to consider that conversation and recognize the meaning and ramifications of what we discussed.  I had a small epiphany.  Here was the epitome of the quote that applied to how a Mormon (at least this Mormon) and an atheist (at least this atheist) thought:

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The Lord works from the inside out. The world works from the outside in. The world would take people out of the slums. Christ takes the slums out of people, and then they take themselves out of the slums. The world would mold men by changing their environment. Christ changes men, who then change their environment. The world would shape human behavior, but Christ can change human nature.

--Ezra Taft Benson  (Ensign July 1989)

When we center everything around Christ everything else has to be somewhat close.  The more detailed you get, the further we are from the central principle.  But we still are close to Christ.

His view was that the core values are a cage within which we can work.

The Lord's way is not to set limits, but allow our judgement to take us where we need to be as long as we are centered on Christ.

His was was about limits and restrictions to do things his way.

Edited by Guest
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Thanks, @Carborendum.  That's a useful example (I tend to recognize these patterns better after having some real-life examples explained to me).  I'm going to have to see if I see this pattern at work (though I'm in the middle of Mormondom, so it may be more subtle or more rare - or not).

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1 hour ago, Carborendum said:

A friend of mine is starting up a corporation.  He intends this to be a very large corporation.  He brought me in to help out with some things.  He kept mentioning the core values of the company in a way that I didn't understand.  That is to say, he was using terminology that was kind of cryptic.

I asked for clarification.  As he explained, I began envisioning the concentric circles model of theology.  It was exactly what he was explaining as company values.  I proceeded to draw the concentric circles model using the values he described.  I showed it to him and began to explain what it meant.  He's an atheist, so the idea that it was somewhat related to theology was off-putting to him.  He ended up interrupting me before my explanation was through. He then suggested that I re-do the model because it didn't accurately depict what he wanted for the company.

He went on to describe a venn diagram of the values (explaining that my model was inaccurate) with the core values on the outside, instead of the concentric circles.  I told him that my model was not a venn diagram and it wasn't intended to be.  He claimed he understood.  But I don't think he did.  In the end he wanted me to re-do it as a venn diagram model to send to the graphic designer.  I did so.

Well, it's been just long enough for me to consider that conversation and recognize the meaning and ramifications of what we discussed.  I had a small epiphany.  Here was the epitome of the quote that applied to how a Mormon (at least this Mormon) and an atheist (at least this atheist) thought:

When we center everything around Christ everything else has to be somewhat close.  The more detailed you get, the further we are from the central principle.  But we still are close to Christ.

His view was that the core values are a cage within which we can work.

The Lord's way is not to set limits, but allow our judgement to take us where we need to be as long as we are centered on Christ.

His was was about limits and restrictions to do things his way.

Aye, this reminds me of the two different approaches to fixing society. Religious leaders know and teach that to fix society you have to start with each individual and their family- fix the home then you can fix society. The government and lawyers see it from the other side of passing laws and regulations that will somehow protect modern family ideals/reshape families and community structure which then fixes, or trys, to fix society.

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@Carborendum. Thanks! I never got this before! I always wondered why Jesus did not: fight poverty, fight for women's rights. DItto for Joseph Smith. One thing that people that I know criticize the lds faith for, is that we were not historically on the side of the angels eg slavery, holocaust. What did we do to help? I do not know how to answer these charges. Clearly God has different priorities than do people. 

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11 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

I always wondered why Jesus did not: fight poverty, fight for women's rights. DItto for Joseph Smith.

They did..  But they did it from the individual out, like @Carborendum pointed out.  Rather then Outside (govermental or otherwise) in

 

They knew that which is imposed from without has to be imposed with a form of force (Physical, social, emotional etc.)... which leads to rebellion and it falling apart.

However that which comes from within... does not need force, and can support itself.

 

Sadly many faithful members of the church just don't see this and so they advocate for worldly methods to fix problems rather then Godly ones.

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12 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

@Carborendum. Thanks! I never got this before! I always wondered why Jesus did not: fight poverty, fight for women's rights. DItto for Joseph Smith. One thing that people that I know criticize the lds faith for, is that we were not historically on the side of the angels eg slavery, holocaust. What did we do to help? I do not know how to answer these charges. Clearly God has different priorities than do people. 

It's not about priorities.  It's about HOW to go about such changes.  And what is it we truly need to change?  Teach people why slavery is wrong.  Teach people why we must care for the poor.  Teach people why women should be treated with just as much respect as men.  Teach people about racial and religious tolerance.

Teach them, they learn, they change their behavior.

Force them, they may temporarily change their behavior when people are looking.  But they never learn anything.  They most likely begin resenting the force and rebel against the principle because of the force.

Man is about improving our circumstances here on earth.  The Lord is about improving the souls of men for all eternity.

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16 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

I always wondered why Jesus did not: fight poverty, fight for women's rights.

Here is an important point to realize and internalize: There is no such thing as Women's Rights. They do not exist. Neither do Gay Rights, nor Black Rights, nor Left-Handed Redhead Rights, nor (especially) Corporate Rights or Animal Rights or even State Rights.

There are only Human Rights. Those are the only kind of rights that exist. No others. If you are a human, you have certain rights. These rights are granted you by God, not by your government.

16 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

One thing that people that I know criticize the lds faith for, is that we were not historically on the side of the angels eg slavery, holocaust. What did we do to help?

People are stupid. (Just so that we're clear on that point.)

As a whole, the early Latter-day Saints were abolitionists and abhorred slavery. True, Joseph Smith made it clear that the Church as an institution did not take a side in the slavery question and that it would not encourage slaves to be discontent in their station. But that is largely because (IMO) Joseph Smith saw that the Church's mission was not to agitate for political change. That was the duty of individual citizens.

One plank of Joseph Smith's presidential candidacy was that he wanted to abolish slavery and make it illegal, and recompense slave owners by buying their slaves from them and setting them free. This idea was mocked as ridiculous foolishness that would cost so much money that it would bankrupt the US. So instead, the fools threw the Mormons out and then fought the ill-named Civil War (or the War of Northern Aggression, if you're a Southerner), the most ruinous war in our history.

So who was on the "side of the angels" there?

Don't pay attention to the idiots who want to retroactively pass judgment on the early Latter-day Saints. They are eminently ignorable.

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On 5/4/2017 at 7:39 PM, Sunday21 said:

@Carborendum. Thanks! I never got this before! I always wondered why Jesus did not: fight poverty, fight for women's rights. 

He absolutely did both. Though, Jesus did not come as the warrior King Messiah. He came as the suffering servant. 

Edited by Blueskye2
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