Feeding People is Cultural Appropriation?

[yjacket]

24 minutes ago, eddified said:

This article about cultural appropriation of food shows a very disturbing trend. It shows a trend away from Christ-like love of all fellow human beings. It shows a trend towards race-based discord and vindictiveness. Very disturbing. 

It's only going to get much, much worse.  When the outgoing Chair of the California Democratic party stands on stage and says "**** Trump", you know we've got a serious problem.  The level of hatred and civil discourse is pretty bad.  While politics has always been dirty and nasty, there was also an understanding of civil decorum and that has degenerated quite rapidly.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, eddified said:

I'm struggling to see what is meant by "Freedom" in this context and how it's different than liberty. I would phrase it "liberals are more about helping "victims" (whatever that means) and conservatives are about freedom and liberty. "

In my lexicon freedom does not require responsibility.  Liberty is a subcategory of freedom which requires responsibility as part and parcel of our philosophy.  Freedom without responsibility is license (subcategory of Freedom).

Much of what the Left cries out for which limits the rights of others while citing freedom is actually license.  Much of what the Right calls out for which limits the rights of others while citing freedom is usually responsibility.

There are more cries from the Left that does nothing for freedom in any way, than there are from the Right.

Edited May 26, 2017 by Guest

[NeuroTypical]

In other news, english-speaking cultures are proud to have successfully exported the following cultural artifacts to various other cultures:

- Human rights
- End to slavery
- Democracy
- Countless advancements in science, medicine, technology, philosophy, etc that has increased health, wealth, longevity, and quality of life.

See, when you come up with something so cool that another culture wants to do it too, that's a good thing.  

[NeuroTypical]

Oh - speaking of english - pretty much every single word in our dictionary was culturally appropriated by some other culture's language.  And we exported that to the world too.

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

Oh - speaking of english - pretty much every single word in our dictionary was culturally appropriated by some other culture's language.  And we exported that to the world too.

Uhmmm.  Not quite buying that.

[NeuroTypical]

Well, keep in mind I said 'pretty much'.  Americans are inventing new words every month these years. But other than that, pretty much everything is from somewhere else. 

Here - knock yourself out.  http://www.etymonline.com/

Also: 

Here: - from Proto-Germanic pronominal stem *hi- (from PIE *ki- "this;" see he) + adverbial suffix -r.

Knock: West Saxon "cnucian"

Yourself:  Your - from Proto-Germanic base of you.  Self - from Proto-Germanic *selbaz (source also of Old Norse sjalfr, Old Frisian self, Dutch zelf, Old High German selb, German selb, selbst, Gothic silba

Out: from Proto-Indo-European root *ud- "up, out, up away"

[eddified]

@NeuroTypical, the way you are talking about language roots is kind of silly. You do have a good point about taking words from other languages, but I wouldn't say "appropriation" is applicable to all of the words you stated as your examples. All languages change over time. So before english, there was something else. English was derived primarily from middle English, right? And before that, early English, no? I mean, I'm no linguist, but English wasn't at the tower of Babel, so it is an *evolved* language. So, words coming from languages from which English is primarily derived, I wouldn't consider to have been "appropriated". But words like "jalapeño" are definitely "appropriated". For example, your citation of "Knock: West Saxon "cnucian""... this is a case where, in my opinion, "appropriation" is not what happened. The saxons were the ancestors of the English people, right? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saxons

So this example of "knock" being appropriated is quite a stretch. Instead, it could be called 'language heritage'. Let me give an analogy. If we think of the words in the "English language" as a family, more specifically, as a set of siblings, then I would consider words 'adopted' into the family (such as "jalapeño" or "tortilla") as "appropriated", but I would not consider words like "knock" as being appropriated since its root ("cnucian") is an ancestor of the family. 

Edited May 26, 2017 by eddified

[eddified]

What I mean is the word "knock" may have been made up, and not appropriated from a different language. If "knock" was made up then it wasn't appropriated by the English language any more than you appropriated your own parents' colloquialisms.

[NeuroTypical]

Ok, I admit, it's a bit of a stretch.

Almost as big a stretch as something being wrong with a white guy making tacos in ways traditionally done by another culture.  

[dahlia]

On 5/24/2017 at 1:59 PM, Godless said:

I think you'd be hard-pressed to find a registered Democrat flying Dixie over his/her front porch. 

Are you kidding? Do you know which party was the party of segregation? Of the Klan? The South is/was full of Democrats who flew the Confederate flag. Blacks continue to vote leftist because they are ignorant of the history of political parties in the US and think the Democrats are on their side.  I'm not one of them.

[Sunday21]

@dahlia. I was really shocked to hear the history of the Democratic Party. I watched a documentary on the history. My knowledge of us politics is really sketchy but this very much surprised me.

Edited May 27, 2017 by Sunday21

[Blueskye2]

The current political party system was not the political party system of the 19th century. To begin with, the issues and political/social ideologies that divided the parties are not aligned to the same issues and political/social ideologies that divide the  party system of today, and the geographic disbursement of party loyalists has flipped.

People, parties and factions within the parties change, sometimes very dramatically, over time, which in turn changes the parties themselves. One most notable is the political party "Big Switch" of the Southern United States. The Southern US votes, generally, as a single (powerful) bloc. Of course there are factions within, areas and individuals, that are not in the general bloc vote, but the bloc itself is very real.

In the late 19th century, the Republican Party was a new political party, arising after the demise of the Whigs. The Southern States were already a voting block of Democrats.  History moves along, and in response to the Civil Rights Movement and associated legislation, the South, as an entire general bloc, switches from voting Democrat to Republican.  

The effect over time, of the ever changing parties and electorates, is that the Democrats used to be the party of the rural South, and now it is the Republicans. This itself has had an effect, of a Southernization of,the Republican Party and an urbanization of the Democratic Party.  Totally flipped, when compared to Lincoln's time.  

But! We may be living in a radical new realignment of urban party loyalty and affiliation...only time will tell.

 

 

Edited May 28, 2017 by Blueskye2

[Guest Godless]

9 minutes ago, Blueskye2 said:

In the late 19th century, the Republican Party was a new political party, arising after the demise of the Whigs. The Southern States were already a voting block of Democrats.  History moves along, and in response to the Civil Rights Movement and associated legislation, the South, as an entire general bloc, switches from voting Democrat to Republican.  

While true, another major factor was the switch in big/small government policies. In the years following the Civil War, it was the Republicans that favored big government while Democrats championed states' rights (especially Southern Dems, later called Dixiecrats, who blamed abolishion on the loss of states' rights). When FDR cemented the shift in political ideology, the Dixiecrats tried (unsuccessfully) to sabatoge Truman's campaign by running their own candidate, Strom Thurmond. After that, the rise of the civil rights movement cemented the Dixiecrat defection to the Republican Party.

So yes, the Republicans were on the right side of history for a while, until suddenly they weren't. 

[mordorbund]

So long as we're talking etymology, does anyone want to address the "little donkey" in the room?

[Guest]

On 5/28/2017 at 2:06 PM, Godless said:

While true, another major factor was the switch in big/small government policies. In the years following the Civil War, it was the Republicans that favored big government while Democrats championed states' rights (especially Southern Dems, later called Dixiecrats, who blamed abolishion on the loss of states' rights). When FDR cemented the shift in political ideology, the Dixiecrats tried (unsuccessfully) to sabatoge Truman's campaign by running their own candidate, Strom Thurmond. After that, the rise of the civil rights movement cemented the Dixiecrat defection to the Republican Party.

So yes, the Republicans were on the right side of history for a while, until suddenly they weren't. 

Actually states rights was not a D/R thing.  It was historically used to support anyone's political agenda.

The North (mostly Republican) used the 10th amendment to nullify the Fugitive Slave Law.

The South (mostly Democrats) used it to nullify restrictions on slavery.

This leaning towards political agenda hasn't really changed much in 200 years.

[Guest]

16 hours ago, mordorbund said:

So long as we're talking etymology, does anyone want to address the "little donkey" in the room?

I'm afraid I'm being a little dense.  So.... huh?

[zil]

16 hours ago, mordorbund said:

So long as we're talking etymology, does anyone want to address the "little donkey" in the room?

What, you mean Burrito, the Tree-Climbing Burro™ ?

[mordorbund]

 

11 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

16 hours ago, mordorbund said:

So long as we're talking etymology, does anyone want to address the "little donkey" in the room?

I'm afraid I'm being a little dense.  So.... huh?

The linked article is about a culturally-appropriated burrito. "burro" = donkey, "ito" = diminutive. Is it supposed to be made from donkey meat? Is that what Mexican donkeys look like? 

[zil]

2 minutes ago, mordorbund said:

The linked article is about a culturally-appropriated burrito. "burro" = donkey, "ito" = diminutive. Is it supposed to be made from donkey meat? Is that what Mexican donkeys look like? 

Actually, "burro" = small donkey, so "burrito" is small, small donkey; or dear, small donkey - depending on which meaning you want to ascribe to "ito".

[Guest]

1 hour ago, mordorbund said:

The linked article is about a culturally-appropriated burrito. "burro" = donkey, "ito" = diminutive. Is it supposed to be made from donkey meat? Is that what Mexican donkeys look like? 

This is the closest I could find to a donkey facepalm.

[zil]

5 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

This is the closest I could find to a donkey facepalm.

Isn't he cute!?  He could be a Burrito.   He looks kinda sad, though.  Probably that barbed wire poking him in the jaw.  Poor, Burrito.

[mordorbund]

15 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

This is the closest I could find to a donkey facepalm.

I would eat that.

I would also put two chips on the rolled tortilla to look like ears.

I don't know which is more appropriate.

[zil]

18 hours ago, mordorbund said:

I would eat that.

I would also put two chips on the rolled tortilla to look like ears.

I don't know which is more appropriate.

In Nairobi, Kenya, there's a restaurant called the Carnivore.  Here's how it works (or worked in 1993, I doubt it's much different)...  You'll need reservations.  They seat sections of the restaurant at a time (why will become obvious).  They bring you a plate and some salad fixings so everyone at the table can mix up their own salad.  Push this aside - there is no room in your stomach for this.  There may be rolls - resist temptation (stuff them in your pocket if you must).  Later, they bring you a baked potato.  Push this aside - there is no room for this either.  At some point, you get a heated metal plate (I can't remember if this is before or after the potato) - you want this.  Finally, the reason you came arrives.  Beefy (har) young men arrive carrying big, honking (like 2-3' long) skewers of cooked meat (they come in waves, giving you time to consume one meat before bringing out the next round of skewers).  One will come to your table and say something like, "Would you like to try the Zebra?" and if you say yes, he carves a piece onto your plate and you chow down.  The only meat I did not try was the crocodile.  My friend said it was kinda like rubbery lobster.  The rest pretty much tasted like dry beef, except the eland - get extra of the eland - they're yummy.

Beyond this, I can recommend visiting Nairobi National Park, Meru (start here - at the right time of year, you'll have the whole place to yourself, with like 4 waiters per person, it's very pretty and relaxing), Aberdare (as I recall, this is where the country club and game preserve are - you can walk right up to the giraffes, though their feet are the size of platters and they look rather intimidating when you're on foot - like they could just pick up one of those feet and pancake you), Samburu, Masai Mara, Amboseli, Tsavo (holy gigantic elephants, Batman), and only one day in Mombasa (the town, not the resort hotels outside town - yawnville).  While you're there, you may as well sneak across the border into Tanzania for pictures of Kilimanjaro.

Edited May 31, 2017 by zil

[Sunday21]

@zil. How interesting!

[unixknight]

Let's just call the outrage over cultural appropriation what it is, shall we?  It's the latest implementation of Segregation, and George Wallace would be thrilled at the way the Thought Police some sectors of the American Left are pushing to separate people by race and culture.

This is why I don't buy into the notion that the Republican and Democrat parties have switched places since the 19th Century.  The approach is different, the rhetoric is different, but the effects aren't.

Disagree with me?  Then how would YOU account for this:

Show me a list of the top 10 cities where black citizens are in the worst socio-economic shape, and I'll show you a list of places where the Democrat party has held power for decades.  Look at Detroit.  Look at Baltimore.  Cities that have gone decades without a Republican mayor or significant Republican influence in city government and yet these are the worst crapholes in terms of crime, poverty, racial tension and urban decay, and almost entirely in black neighborhoods.

By their fruits shall ye know them.

It's plain as day to me, and I'm not even a Republican.  (Libertarian, if you're curious.)