I've Made a Mistake


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My husband's faith and testimony has been an ongoing battle. We've been married 11 years and have 2 children. From the start, I've been the one to uplift and encourage. Sundays have always been a challenge to get to church because there is an excuse half the time. We used to say family prayers. As much as I've wanted so much to study scriptures together, it hasn't happened and I end up doing it alone. 

He has become more worldly overtime. It began with bringing inappropriate media into our home. Telling him to turn it off resulted in fights. Then it always became something he disagreed with in the church. Right now he refuses to support Uchtdorf to be our next prophet for political reasons.  I've fought so hard to be the one to keep our family afloat in the church, and now I'm failing miserably. No more family prayers. Studying scriptures is still a joke. The inappropriate media has never stopped. Our children are young (3 and 1), but our family is falling apart.

I've given up and my faith is almost gone. I'm badly losing my testimony and am starting to not believe in anything anymore. I'm becoming more worldly myself now as I have given up on fighting to keep our family strong in the church.

I wanted to marry a man who would uplift and encourage me, not tear me down. I wanted to marry a man who kept his priesthood strong, not one who let his temple recommend expire and lapse (he hasn't been in years). I wanted a man who fights to keep his family strong in the church, not one who makes excuses.  He's threatened to not raise the children in the church if I leave him over this. He's making me choose between the church and my family. 

I'm so worn out and I fear for the future of our children and family. Especially in this world.

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Reading between the lines it sounds like you still believe, or at the very least, you badly want to believe. 

My heart hurts for you and your family. The advice that comes into my head right now is to nurture your testimony on your own. Read your personal scriptures and say your personal prayers. 

Also, try to love him for who he is. See the good in him. Accept his decision to be worldly and love him anyway. I would not recommend that you leave him -- rather I strongly recommend that you stay with him. You didn't mention abuse so I assume it is still very important for your children that you stay together.  

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I think you need some encouragement. You can learn to be the spiritual strength of the family. It's critical that you do, for the children. Don't fight to hold family scriptures, for example, just read them with the children once they get a little older, you can start with the children's illustrated scripture stories. They are available in the Gospel Library app. 

You CAN have a testimony of your own. Just start doing the important things. I know you can. Start small. God bless. 

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@AGMom, I'm so sorry for your struggles.  I agree with @eddified - forget fighting about anything.  You cannot change another person, only yourself.  And you can change yourself in ways that will bring you peace and happiness despite your husband's choices - which may be the best way to encourage him to return to the gospel.  Specific thoughts:

1) Don't fight about scripture study, just do your own, and do it with your children as you decide is appropriate.  If needed, do it while he's at work, or asleep, or whatever.  But avoid making him feel excluded - make sure he knows you'd love to have him join you, but it's his choice and you won't complain if he chooses not to.

2) Same thing with prayer - you personally, and you and the children together.  Also with church: just go to church and take the kids with you.  Don't worry about whether he's going to come.  If you think it appropriate, invite him.

3) Leave the room and take the children1 with you if he starts watching inappropriate media.  If needed, put in headphones so you don't have to hear it. ( 1 I don't believe for a minute that any child is ever too young to be impacted by "inappropriate".)

(If "inappropriate" is "pornographic", I would worry very much and seek counseling.)

4) Request home and visiting teachers who will come.  Doesn't matter if your husband doesn't sit in when the home teachers come.

5) If you have a calling, do your best to serve in it.  If you don't, let the bishop know you'd like to serve in some way.

Right now, you need to focus on building your personal strength and testimony (put your own oxygen mask on first).  Let the Lord worry about the rest right now.  When we put the things of the Lord first, and become peacemakers at home, the Lord blesses us to endure and overcome trials.  It won't be easy, it will probably take a long time, and a lot of effort, but I believe you will be blessed for it.

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@zil, I agree Regarding (3) - removing yourself from the room when something inappropriate is on the TV.... I have family members that watch things on TV which I am uncomfortable watching. This becomes an issue when I am their guest for a muti-day stay. It is extremely difficult to avoid it since it's on all the time. In the evening when the kids are in bed, my wife and I have to find a different place to hang out so we don't have to be affected by the   filth on the TV. But if the bedrooms all have children sleeping then where do we go? It is extremely difficult. But I still think it is the right thing to do. 

It can be very hard, but stick to your principles. 

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53 minutes ago, eddified said:

@zil, I agree Regarding (3) - removing yourself from the room when something inappropriate is on the TV.... I have family members that watch things on TV which I am uncomfortable watching. This becomes an issue when I am their guest for a muti-day stay. It is extremely difficult to avoid it since it's on all the time. In the evening when the kids are in bed, my wife and I have to find a different place to hang out so we don't have to be affected by the   filth on the TV. But if the bedrooms all have children sleeping then where do we go? It is extremely difficult. But I still think it is the right thing to do. 

It can be very hard, but stick to your principles. 

I agree with this advice!

My very devout Mormon mother was married to my non-member alcoholic father for 20 years.  My father brought all kinds of inappropriate influences into my childhood home.  He was a diehard Frank Zappa fan who loved watching R-rated movies, smoking cigarettes, and stuff like that.  He didn't care about the Church and refused to discuss religion.  Eventually, his behavior progressed to having affairs, and that is what ended the marriage.

How did my mom survive for 20 years?  Well, you would have to talk with her about that.  But I think she did what @eddifiedsaid: she stuck to her principles and tried to isolate herself and me and my brothers from whatever worldly filth my father was happening to indulge in.  She wouldn't let pornography into our house, and said, for other inappropriate media, if my father wanted to indulge, he needed to use headphones and do it out of her presence.  She stayed strong in the Church and did what she had to do to raise myself and my two brothers in the gospel.  Today, my mother is still active in the Church, and all three of her sons are returned missionaries who married in the temple.  

I think my mother would say, in these types of situations, to pray hard about what the proper course is, maybe even counsel with the bishop, stay close to the Church, and do your best to isolate yourself and your children from worldly influence, and try and be a good influence as you can be to the husband.  

EDIT: And try and do what @Sunday21 below says - try and work on your relationship with the guy!  Who knows, maybe you will wind up saving him and bringing him back to the Church?

Edited by DoctorLemon
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Agree with previous postings. Suggestion is there something that you and hubbie like doing together? Gaming? Walk? Sex? Anything? Maybe try that? I have a friend who married a not very nice person and she decided that sex would be their thing. She made time for this regularly. They have been married about 20 years so it seems to work for them.

Really, really sorry this has happened. Of course you are upset! Big hugs! 

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Ditto to everything Zil said. What I say below is with the assumption that there is no abuse or mistreatment of yourself or the kids, he just isn't living church standards. 

I trust that before you got married, you prayed and felt that this was the right thing to do.  God knew things would turn out like this when he gave you confirmation, and just because it hasn't turned out the way you want doesn't mean that you made a mistake.  That is a dangerous and destructive thought.

It may be that there is something God wants you to learn from this, or something he wants you to overcome.  This may be him putting you through a refining fire to purify your soul.  It may be that you are there to be his guide and example and help him make it back onto a gospel path.  You may have even promised to do that for him in the pre-existance for all you know.  Don't try to push him to do what you want him to do, instead talk with God about what He wants you to do. 

This might not make sense to you now, but your relationship with your husband is more important than if your husband is doing the right things or not.  Honor and praise him for the good things he does, teach your children to respect him as the head of the home, do not withhold love and affection and intimacy because he isn't a faithful Mormon.  Feeling nagged, pressured, judged, rejected, etc. will be a big barrier to him coming back.  Feeling loved, accepted and respected will open his heart and make it easier for him to come back.  No matter how unrealistic the idea of him coming back seems now, it is not hopeless.  Pray for him, keep the door open but don't try to push him through it.  You are not alone, you have the Bishop, his quorum and quorum presidency, your HTs

Also, Elder Uchtdorf is not going to be the next prophet.  The next President of the church will be the apostle who has been serving in the 12 the longest, and right now that is Elder Russel M. Nelson.  Elder Oaks is next in line after him and there are 3 more after him before you get to Elder Uchtdorf.  There is no way to know if he will ever be the President of the Church, but if so it will be a very long time in the future.  I assume by 'political' he means what Elder Uchtdorf has said about refugees.  He has not said anything about what government policy should be, he as only encouraged compassion and service towards those in need.  I know a lot of people read more into that then they should in this political climate.

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27 minutes ago, Latter-Day Marriage said:

Ditto to everything Zil said. What I say below is with the assumption that there is no abuse or mistreatment of yourself or the kids, he just isn't living church standards. 

I trust that before you got married, you prayed and felt that this was the right thing to do.  God knew things would turn out like this when he gave you confirmation, and just because it hasn't turned out the way you want doesn't mean that you made a mistake.  That is a dangerous and destructive thought.

It may be that there is something God wants you to learn from this, or something he wants you to overcome.  This may be him putting you through a refining fire to purify your soul.  It may be that you are there to be his guide and example and help him make it back onto a gospel path.  You may have even promised to do that for him in the pre-existance for all you know.  Don't try to push him to do what you want him to do, instead talk with God about what He wants you to do. 

This might not make sense to you now, but your relationship with your husband is more important than if your husband is doing the right things or not.  Honor and praise him for the good things he does, teach your children to respect him as the head of the home, do not withhold love and affection and intimacy because he isn't a faithful Mormon.  Feeling nagged, pressured, judged, rejected, etc. will be a big barrier to him coming back.  Feeling loved, accepted and respected will open his heart and make it easier for him to come back.  No matter how unrealistic the idea of him coming back seems now, it is not hopeless.  Pray for him, keep the door open but don't try to push him through it.  You are not alone, you have the Bishop, his quorum and quorum presidency, your HTs

Also, Elder Uchtdorf is not going to be the next prophet.  The next President of the church will be the apostle who has been serving in the 12 the longest, and right now that is Elder Russel M. Nelson.  Elder Oaks is next in line after him and there are 3 more after him before you get to Elder Uchtdorf.  There is no way to know if he will ever be the President of the Church, but if so it will be a very long time in the future.  I assume by 'political' he means what Elder Uchtdorf has said about refugees.  He has not said anything about what government policy should be, he as only encouraged compassion and service towards those in need.  I know a lot of people read more into that then they should in this political climate.

I thought it very odd indeed that the guy has a problem with Uchdorf!  I mean, how can anyone not like Uchdorf?  The man is compassion personified!

Edited by DoctorLemon
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40 minutes ago, Latter-Day Marriage said:

This might not make sense to you now, but your relationship with your husband is more important than if your husband is doing the right things or not.  Honor and praise him for the good things he does, teach your children to respect him as the head of the home, do not withhold love and affection and intimacy because he isn't a faithful Mormon.  Feeling nagged, pressured, judged, rejected, etc. will be a big barrier to him coming back.  Feeling loved, accepted and respected will open his heart and make it easier for him to come back.  No matter how unrealistic the idea of him coming back seems now, it is not hopeless.  Pray for him, keep the door open but don't try to push him through it. 

LDMarriage and I have had plenty of disagreements, but on this we agree 110%.  Last year you posted on a similar topic.

In that you posted the following

"46 percent of mothers in the U.S. feel more stressed out by their husbands than their children, according to a new survey.A poll of over 7,000 mothers across the country, conducted by Today Moms, found that because of different parenting views, a lack of help with household duties, and the typical pressures of marriage, many mothers feel that their husbands are just another child to take care of. What's more, the average mother reported her stress level overall at a whopping 8.5 out of ten."

and mentioned that your husband is looking at inappropriate videos (pornography, if not outright nudity-close to it).

What you husband is doing using pornography is wrong.  No ifs, ands, or buts.  At the same time, there is a huge difference between what the world teaches a family should look like and the way God wants the family to be.  And your quote above illustrates a significant portion of the problem.  For some reason in today's society women are told and society emphasizes that as soon as a woman becomes a mother that all her focus, energy, desires, hopes, dreams, wishes, etc. should be put towards being a "good mom" . . .and at the same time she should also be working and at the same time she should be "mother-hen" to her husband.

If you look, my guess is that a significant portion of your troubles either started or significantly increased after having children. There is a reason for this.  Except for the period of time where a baby needs their mother on a consistent basis (approx 1st year). The most important person in the family is your spouse; if that is not the case-you are doing it wrong.  Also recognize that your husband is a fully formed adult able to make his own personal decisions.  If you are trying to control the personal decisions he is making-you are doing it wrong. You can counsel, give guidance (like honey, I'd love for you to be at church today, but I understand if you don't come), but when you try to control-you are doing it wrong.  Your husband needs your understanding and your compassion, not someone who picks on him and tells him everything he is doing wrong.  Giving understanding to you husband isn't conceding to the least bit you agree with his decisions-but just that you recognize that he has different factors, stressors, life experiences that has brought him to this point and that he his choosing this path.  You do't have to like it, you don't have to agree with it-but you do need to support him as the priesthood head of the family.

You have great concern for your children and that is good.  One of the secrets I've learned in my life is that the best thing I can do for my children to raise them right is to show them that I love my spouse.  That she is more important than they are, that they (my children) are appendages to my marriage-it existed before they were here and will exist after they leave.  That no matter the trials and struggles (and yes marriage is probably one of the hardest things a person will do), it will survive and thrive.  This teaching provides children the best stable foundation for them to develop and grow into adults.  

Divorce is absolutely devastating on society-it is a scourge and a blight. It is my opinion that everything we are dealing with now as a society directly comes from the acceptance and commonality of divorce.  Children of divorce will have more mental health issues, more confidence issues, more problems in life than those that do not come from divorce.  Sometimes divorce is necessary (adultery or abuse) simply because the action causes such damage that it is very hard to repair.  Otherwise Christ and the prophets have taught we are to endure and make it work.  

We don't get a mulligan or a do-over b/c when the going gets tough we murmur, complain, or wonder if we'd made a mistake. What God asks us to do in those instance where our marriage becomes very tough is to become more Christlike.  He challenges us to learn how to emulate our Savior more, how to be more compassionate, more understanding, more willing to forgive our spouse's fault.

For your marriage to work, you have to eliminate all the outs-completely banish from your mind any thoughts of divorce or separation. Only consider those options if your husband either commits adultery or abuse.  Then work to love him as Christ loves him; do not force him to repent or go to church, set the example, honor your husband and eventually things will get better.  And yes, things will get better. 

 

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1 hour ago, DoctorLemon said:

I thought it very odd indeed that the guy has a problem with Uchdorf!  I mean, how can anyone not like Uchdorf?  The man is compassion personified!

The church teaches us to treat people with kindness and offer help to those in need, and that is right and good, but sadly there is a large number of members who misunderstand the message and think the church is calling for open boarders and no security screening of people trying to claim refugee status.  It's understandable since those who do call for such policies cloak them in similar language, but that is not the position of the church.

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55 minutes ago, Latter-Day Marriage said:

The church teaches us to treat people with kindness and offer help to those in need, and that is right and good, but sadly there is a large number of members who misunderstand the message and think the church is calling for open boarders and no security screening of people trying to claim refugee status.  It's understandable since those who do call for such policies cloak them in similar language, but that is not the position of the church.

Yeap, if they are here we should be charitable and compassionate to them (the Good Samaritan).  We should hope for a solution that ends their desire to leave their homeland.

And IMO we should hope for a solution that restricts their ability to be in this country and remove them if possible . . .but if they are our neighbors we should still be charitable.

Even if things like this drive me bonkers:

http://www.idahostatesman.com/news/state/article142759434.html

After the Fawnbrook case, the Refugee Center partnered with a behavioral agency to hold therapy groups with school-aged refugee children who’d recently arrived in Twin Falls “so they understand that type of behavior isn’t acceptable,” Rwasama said.

Yeah . . .good luck with that. 14,10,7 year old sexually assault a 5-year old.  No amount of "therapy groups" is going to fix that behavior-that behavior is learned in the home.  SMH . . .we are idiots.

Edited by yjacket
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Why does your husband have a problem with the church? There would appear to be a more deeper rooted issue happening than just his opinion of Uchtdorf that would cause him to turn away from the church like this that hasn't been mentioned if I'm following everything.

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Thank you so much for your words of advice. I've tried talking to him about why he's losing interest, and he says it's not so much the gospel itself, but he's starting to doubt and have issues with the leaders of the church. If I tell him or advise him to pray about it, it upsets him- so I don't know what else to say.

But, y'all are right. I need to stop pushing it and just continue with my own daily scripture reading and prayers. I DO still have faith in the church and the gospel, though times I feel really discouraged and alone. He comes to church with us almost every week, but his testimony of our leaders is going downhill. I've told him before that his habits are harming him, but he refuses to believe it. So for now, I'll follow advice and just stop nagging him about it- and just love him anyway. Now I'll just listen to his doubts and struggles and stop offering advice. I feel like any advice I give offends him anyway, and he feels I'm not hearing him.

As for the older post and the issues with the images he was viewing, that (to my knowledge), has stopped. When I brought it to his attention that day and told him the following days how it made me feel, he apologized. He said it wasn't because he wasn't attracted to me, but he felt I had been pulling away from him, stopped being affectionate, and felt I rejected him every time he tried to get close (which is mostly true- and I blame a lot of that on my lack of self esteem since my body has changed after children). But as far as I know, he no longer does that. Mostly the "inappropriate" things I mention are TV shows and YouTube videos full of profanity. He stopped watching those around the children when our oldest was about 2-2.5 (he's now 3). If it's just us and I make a comment about the language, he'll switch it off or find something else. He doesn't understand the need to stop them entirely, claiming they don't affect the spirit, but I know it does. I just don't know what else to say without sounding like a nag. I think he knows it too, but just isn't willing to give it up. 

Again, thank you for your wisdom. And yes, his issues with Uchtdorf are political. I don't think he's given the guy a chance. I sure love Uchtdorf and his strong spirit!

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On 6/2/2017 at 2:53 PM, Bootcamper said:

Why does your husband have a problem with the church? There would appear to be a more deeper rooted issue happening than just his opinion of Uchtdorf that would cause him to turn away from the church like this that hasn't been mentioned if I'm following everything.

According to him, he's starting to doubt the leadership of the church. He also says he's spent his entire life giving his service and money to the church, and feels burned out. 

Edited by AGMom
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7 hours ago, AGMom said:

 He also says he's spent his entire life giving his service and money to the church, and feels burned out. 

He's not alone in that feeling. Many people probably feel that way but they are afraid of vocalizing it. I think there is a big difference between this feeling and a feeling of "I'm going to leave the church" 

Edited by MormonGator
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AGmom hang in there, im in a similar situation, my wife left the church completely about 6 years ago. The first few years were hard but im slowly realizing that I need to change my perspective on the situation. The problem is that I see her as someone who rejected the church and because the church means a lot to me she therefore rejects me. I guess I got too much pride.

I thought about what would happen if we got divorced, what if I fell in love with another woman who was not religious? I would not have any type of religious expectations of her and I would just simply love her for who she is. That is the perspective that I am trying to gain with my wife, its hard but its what Christ would do.

One thing that does not help is attending church every sunday and the members wondering where my wife is. The looks on peoples faces and some of the conversations I have with ward friends and leaders is that they care so much for her welfare that we must be doing something wrong. That is when church feels like its a toxic environment when people cannot use their Christ eyes and Christ mouths.

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12 hours ago, priesthoodpower said:

The looks on peoples faces and some of the conversations I have with ward friends and leaders is that they care so much for her welfare that we must be doing something wrong. That is when church feels like its a toxic environment when people cannot use their Christ eyes and Christ mouths.

Unfortunately, I think this may be a product of the modern world.  If you have a bad kid people look at you like your a bad parent; if your spouse is not at church sometimes people think there is something you are doing wrong.

Loving someone, demonstrating kindness, etc. may help someone come back to church-but that shouldn't be why we do it.  Disciplining a child because they hit their sibling may help them to learn not to hit, but that shouldn't be why we do it.  We do these things b/c they are the right things to do regardless of whether the outcome is the desired outcome.

Human beings are not rats, if I do this or if I do that, if I say this or if I say that then this person would be obedient, then this person would come back to church. We all have the ability to choose what we want in life and an essential part of being a parent and in being a spouse is understanding that we can't control the individual we love.

We do the right things not b/c we want them to change their behavior, but simply because they are the right things to do.  I guess this is a long way of saying, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. If we all realized this life would be much better.

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