Guest Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 30 minutes ago, MormonGator said: We agree again. Run to the hills everyone, @estradling75 and I agree on something. You need to pick and choose your battles. If you preach all the time and never shut up, eventually you'll turn into a more pathetic, self righteous version of Cassandra. Sure, you might be right but if everyone ignores you you eventually are doing it to show how righteous you are. Cassandra? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
estradling75 Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 27 minutes ago, MormonGator said: We agree again. Run to the hills everyone, @estradling75 and I agree on something. You need to pick and choose your battles. If you preach all the time and never shut up, eventually you'll turn into a more pathetic, self righteous version of Cassandra. Sure, you might be right but if everyone ignores you you eventually are doing it to show how righteous you are. Indeed.. By the same token if someone is calling you out it might be wise to stop and think if they have a point. For example if you are watching an R-rated movie and someone calls you out, own the fact that you have chosen not to follow the council, even if you choose to ignore them and go ahead anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Just now, Carborendum said: Cassandra? Cassandra is a figure from Greek mythology who was gifted with prophecy. Sadly, she was cursed that no one would believe her prophecies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
estradling75 Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, Carborendum said: Cassandra? Greek myth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cassandra Someone cursed to know the future/truth but have no one believe or listen to them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, estradling75 said: Greek myth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cassandra Someone cursed to know the future/truth but have no one believe or listen to them It's so fascinating a story, isn't it? Many times (no, not always) in Greek literature those who are cursed deserved it in some way. Yet Cassandra is guilty of nothing, so her situation becomes even more tragic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 9 minutes ago, MormonGator said: Cassandra is a figure from Greek mythology who was gifted with prophecy. Sadly, she was cursed that no one would believe her prophecies. THAT Cassandra. I just happen to know some Cassandras, and there are several others in books I've read recently, so I didn't make the connection. Thanks to my friend with the English Degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddified Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 1 hour ago, estradling75 said: Of course... but everyone thinks that they are on to something.. that is the Core of the problem. If you tell me smoking is wrong you are of course on to something. You think you are being helpful by telling me this. But chances are I already know and I have made my choice. So I fire back that you are being unrighteously judgemental, and nosy because you are. And I think I am being helpful by telling you this because I am onto something. And the cycle continues Because my comments are also unrighteous judgemental and you are onto something by calling me out on it. My cousin smokes, has for years. I asked him if he was worried about the health effects. He said no; he thinks that as long as he eats healthy food and exercises, smoking won't kill him. Guess you can't convince people of the truth if they don't want to hear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 1 minute ago, Carborendum said: THAT Cassandra. I just happen to know some Cassandras, and there are several others in books I've read recently, so I didn't make the connection. Thanks to my friend with the English Degree. A degree that is useless in the real world but can make you sound erudite. I'm sure my Daddy is happy that he spent 80,000$ in tuition for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
estradling75 Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 3 minutes ago, MormonGator said: It's so fascinating a story, isn't it? Many times (no, not always) in Greek literature those who are cursed deserved it in some way. Yet Cassandra is guilty of nothing, so her situation becomes even more tragic. Indeed... I see her story as more of a metaphor then a personal story (but the personal story is tragic). Some times we get so wrapped up in our personal struggles that we can't see the forest for the trees. Yet someone farther off isn't as wrapped up might see more clearly and truly (aka a Cassandra). Yet when they sound warning trying to help us see more clearly, we ignore belittle and degrade them. Because after all they are not in our shoes so how could they possibly know what is best? Thus this whole issue we are discussing is at least as old as Greeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 2 minutes ago, MormonGator said: A degree that is useless in the real world but can make you sound erudite. I'm sure my Daddy is happy that he spent 80,000$ in tuition for that. I wouldn't sell yourself short. Read The Thomas Jefferson Education by Oliver DeMille. BTW, my eldest brother has an English Degree. And he is probably the most capable -- and certainly the most wealthy -- of my entire family. Unfortunately, he's also gay. So, he left the Church a while back. C'est la vie. You're not going to come out as gay on this forum, are you? Edited July 27, 2017 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 16 minutes ago, MormonGator said: It's so fascinating a story, isn't it? Many times (no, not always) in Greek literature those who are cursed deserved it in some way. Yet Cassandra is guilty of nothing, so her situation becomes even more tragic. I thought it was a lesson in life. Many times people expect others to react because you have knowledge. But more people react because of what you do (because of what you know). what did Cassandra actually do with what she knew? It's not that she could have done a lot being a woman in ancient Greece. It was the basic principle being taught by the myth that people respect actions more than words or knowledge. -- It was also in keeping with the tradition of the Ancient Greeks that one could not deny a god or goddess. Edited July 27, 2017 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, Carborendum said: I wouldn't sell yourself short. Read The Thomas Jefferson Education by Oliver DeMille. BTW, my eldest brother has an English Degree. And he is probably the most capable -- and certainly the most wealthy -- of my entire family. Unfortunately, he's also gay. So, he left the Church a while back. C'est la vie. You're not going to come out as gay on this forum, are you? In high school I was accused of being gay because I'm not into the traditional guy stuff. When Dale said "Are you gay?"I said "Your girlfriend doesn't think so" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 24 minutes ago, MormonGator said: It's so fascinating a story, isn't it? Many times (no, not always) in Greek literature those who are cursed deserved it in some way. Yet Cassandra is guilty of nothing, so her situation becomes even more tragic. Here's something interesting. This part I had not heard before: Some versions of the story indicate that she had originally promised herself to Apollo for the gift of prophecy. When she received it, she went back on her promise and denied him. That was when Apollo cursed her with insanity. Some say she actually did go insane. Other versions say she was not, but merely thought to be insane. This pattern of blessing and curse (or sometimes curse then blessing) is based on the Greek belief that anything done by the gods could not be undone. But something else can be given/taken to offset it. Another myth was of a man who accidentally came upon Athena while bathing and immediately looked way for propriety's sake. But she saw him and cursed him with blindness. When he explained his innocence in the matter, she couldn't give him his sight back. But he gave him visions (prophecy) as well as your basic psychic type gifts. Dear English Friend, who was that man? Edited July 27, 2017 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maureen Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, estradling75 said: You do realize that you just preached loudly about the flaws of others... just now right? Now who's cherry picking and not reading the post in context? M. Edited July 27, 2017 by Maureen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
estradling75 Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Maureen said: Now who's cherry picking and not reading the post in context? M. You... Had you followed the discussion MormonGator had based on that post, you would notice that we had a very nice discussion about all the issues, and even came to a point where we agreed. But go ahead and continue to cherry pick, you just reinforce our opinions about you. Edited July 27, 2017 by estradling75 mirkwood, Vort and a mustard seed 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maureen Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 25 minutes ago, estradling75 said: You... Had you followed the discussion MormonGator had based on that post, you would notice that we had a very nice discussion about all the issues, and even came to a point where we agreed. But go ahead and continue to cherry pick, you just reinforce our opinions about you. I read the rest of the thread. It's great that you both have come to agree but you still cherry picked what you commented on, ignoring the rest of the post where @MormonGator was pointing out that he recognized that characteristic since he used to be just like that. Don't whine about how other posters comment if you're going to do the exact same thing. M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Carborendum said: Here's something interesting. This part I had not heard before: Some versions of the story indicate that she had originally promised herself to Apollo for the gift of prophecy. When she received it, she went back on her promise and denied him. That was when Apollo cursed her with insanity. Some say she actually did go insane. Other versions say she was not, but merely thought to be insane. That IS interesting. I've always thought she did not go insane but was merely thought to be insane. To me it's like when Hamlet is first seen by Ophelia (speaking of madness) after he learns from Ur-Hamlet about his mother and uncle. Same kind of thing. Off topic-I played Oedipus in a college play. The woman who played Jocasta and I had great chemistry on stage but off stage barely knew each other and ran with totally different crowds. Go figure! 1 hour ago, Carborendum said: This pattern of blessing and curse (or sometimes curse then blessing) is based on the Greek belief that anything done by the gods could not be undone. But something else can be given/taken to offset it. Another myth was of a man who accidentally came upon Athena while bathing and immediately looked way for propriety's sake. But she saw him and cursed him with blindness. When he explained his innocence in the matter, she couldn't give him his sight back. But he gave him visions (prophecy) as well as your basic psychic type gifts. Dear English Friend, who was that man? I do not know my um...German friend? (playing! We all know @Carborendum is Finnish!) Edited July 27, 2017 by MormonGator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, estradling75 said: Indeed... I see her story as more of a metaphor then a personal story (but the personal story is tragic). Some times we get so wrapped up in our personal struggles that we can't see the forest for the trees. Yet someone farther off isn't as wrapped up might see more clearly and truly (aka a Cassandra). Yet when they sound warning trying to help us see more clearly, we ignore belittle and degrade them. Because after all they are not in our shoes so how could they possibly know what is best? Thus this whole issue we are discussing is at least as old as Greeks. Really good interpretation, for sure. I see it as both a metaphor and a personal story as well. Edited July 27, 2017 by MormonGator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 25 minutes ago, MormonGator said: (playing! We all know @Carborendum is Finnish!) Which reminds me of the one about the 3 men at the restroom of an international airport: One was Finnish, one was Russian, and one was European. askandanswer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 6 minutes ago, zil said: Which reminds me of the one about the 3 men at the restroom of an international airport: One was Finnish, one was Russian, and one was European. How could such a sweet, innocent LDS girl know such a filthy joke! Go to your bishop immediately young lady! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 22 minutes ago, zil said: Which reminds me of the one about the 3 men at the restroom of an international airport: One was Finnish, one was Russian, and one was European. YOOrinferMAYshun At attention, 'cause you're in formation! Twenty miles, for your information! You'll run hard out yonder With hours to ponder The process of urine formation! zil 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Folk Prophet Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, MormonGator said: If you preach all the time and never shut up, eventually you'll turn into a more pathetic, self righteous version of Cassandra. Sure, you might be right but if everyone ignores you you eventually are doing it to show how righteous you are. Exactly. Noah should have just shut his yap. And Abinadi. What a pathetic, self-righteous person. And that Thomas Monson. Never shuts up. Always preaching. Obviously just trying to show us all how righteous he is. Edited July 27, 2017 by The Folk Prophet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 3 minutes ago, Vort said: YOOrinferMAYshun At attention, 'cause you're in formation! Twenty miles, for your information! You'll run hard out yonder With hours to ponder The process of urine formation! You guys watch too many Adam Sandler movies. Tsk, tsk tsk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Just now, MormonGator said: You guys watch too many Adam Sandler movies. Tsk, tsk tsk. Never watched one in my life. My dad told me that joke, thus making it a true dad joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) 6 minutes ago, zil said: Never watched one in my life. My dad told me that joke, thus making it a true dad joke. Knew I liked you. I can't stand him or his terrible movies. I've only seen one, thank goodness. I was in high school and my "friends" were going. I went with them hoping to laugh. I was the only one in the theatre who found it silly and infantile. And I was like 16, his prime age group. Growing up in NH (where he is tragically from) law 211 is that everyone must like Adam Sandler or be shot on sight. I know three people who died because they dislike him. I barely made it out of there. Seriously, I never got the attraction of a 40-something year old making silly voices and jokes that a fifth grade would find immature. I could go on for pages about my dislike of the guy. Edited July 27, 2017 by MormonGator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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