Temple work

[Sunday21]

@mustardseed. I agree and I find it very hopeful when people tell me that the way, we feel in the temple is our true self. That is, how we are without the influence of satan. 

[Fether]

4 hours ago, Jane_Doe said:

The idea of a "swipe card" sounded exactly like just checking off a box to me.  Maybe I misunderstood the previous post.

Aka skip the learning?  

Actions themselves are useless without learning.  

It is only a check the box system when we make it one.

and learning is only one reason to go to the temple. If we have a family of 5 and we can either get them all baptized, confirmed, initiated, endowed and sealed in one day... we will definitely learn from that even if the endowment is cut down.

[Guest]

Full version session for first timers/own endowment and those who want a refresher in this life, then a short version for proxy ordinance work for our kindred dead, we would be a bit selfish if we want the proxy endowment for our benefit when it's for our ancestors. Purpose of the Temple, ....Temple 'work' . ..ordinance work for our ancestors and the living,  our ancestors need the work done for them, they are waiting, some have been waiting a long time. 

Edited August 6, 2017 by Guest

[Guest]

I suppose I'm lucky in that my wife and I go twice a month to do her family file, and I get endowments done for at least three blokes on her family history.  I'm  a practical bloke, as I'm a carpenter, and I go to do Temple 'work' ( mostly endowments ) that's what it is for me, 'Temple work',  if I get a spiritual experience now and then, well that's a bonus. 

Edited August 6, 2017 by Guest

[a mustard seed]

1 hour ago, Lehite said:

Full version session for first timers/own endowment and those who want a refresher in this life, then a short version for proxy ordinance work for our kindred dead, we would be a bit selfish if we want the proxy endowment for our benefit when it's for our ancestors. Purpose of the Temple, ....Temple 'work' . ..ordinance work for our ancestors and the living,  our ancestors need the work done for them, they are waiting, some have been waiting a long time. 

You mean the dead, as "first timers" don't get the benefit of a full session for their endowment? I think I owe them that when I go as a proxy for them, that they get to have their first time(and only, obviously) full to every last word, rather than skipped through because doing it for them is inconvenient for me.

[Sunday21]

But I have a stack of names to get through! What am I meant to do with all these names? At my current rate of progress, I will be buried with my stack of endowment cards and so will many people. This is a crisis! 

[a mustard seed]

1 minute ago, Sunday21 said:

But I have a stack of names to get through! What am I meant to do with all these names? At my current rate of progress, I will be buried with my stack of endowment cards and so will many people. This is a crisis! 

Write a journal and do a detailed genealogy chart so some progeny(either yours or in your line) can follow in your footsteps? ^^;;  Maybe pray and ask for help? It might eventually show up in some way. Maybe you're at the point where you can find the names and clear up the tree, fill in those holes. Maybe someone else in your family, a distant cousin's great grandson, is supposed to become LDS and find your chart, the footsteps you laid down, and do the temple work part of it? When you connect names already on charts on ancestry, doesn't it say whether they are "reserved" or not because those names are on another person's tree?

[Sunday21]

13 minutes ago, a mustard seed said:

Write a journal and do a detailed genealogy chart so some progeny(either yours or in your line) can follow in your footsteps? ^^;;  Maybe pray and ask for help? It might eventually show up in some way. Maybe you're at the point where you can find the names and clear up the tree, fill in those holes. Maybe someone else in your family, a distant cousin's great grandson, is supposed to become LDS and find your chart, the footsteps you laid down, and do the temple work part of it? When you connect names already on charts on ancestry, doesn't it say whether they are "reserved" or not because those names are on another person's tree?

I am it! I am the only lds person in my family. When I die, those cards are going with me. We have many people in my ward with the same problem. One lady has a stack about 5 inches thick and she is in her mid80s. There are too many genealogy doing Mormons and not enough temple going ones...and it takes too long to get endowments done! My records will sit in granite mountain until the millennium.

[Guest]

17 hours ago, a mustard seed said:

You mean the dead, as "first timers" don't get the benefit of a full session for their endowment? I think I owe them that when I go as a proxy for them, that they get to have their first time(and only, obviously) full to every last word, rather than skipped through because doing it for them is inconvenient for me.

"First timers" as in ' own' ( live endowment. ) ..living not dead.  Have the full session. The dead probably  have more info on the other side of the vale and are not bound by time, like we are. An average human has only  90 years on earth, a lot spent sleeping, a lot spent working for a living, a lot spent doing family stuff , church stuff, own interests, also maybe looking after someone, in the end there is not much time to do Temple work. 

" inconvenient " is not the problem, .... time is. , or 'lack of it' 

Back to the original problem, being a 'bottleneck' at the Temple , finding names is a lot more quicker and easier than it has ever been in history, that side has speeded up considerably. Doing the work for them in the Temple hasn't kept up the the same momentum. 

The endowment has changed and been shortened over the years, till now, when finding ancestors has speeded up but not the endowment. 

..but that's not for us to say really, we just do and obey, and plod on, "Faith in every footstep" , praying and hoping the Lord will show the prophet what needs to be done, trusting in him, and if that means to carry on as we are fair enough.  Patience, patience,patience,  take your time and do what you can with what time you have, pace yourself and ..sigh. , sorry ancestors, you've waited this long, you can wait a bit longer. Let the bottleneck get bigger. I remember when it used to be only one to  two years waiting time for male endowment Temple file to be done from first submitting them. Now it's well over ten years, ...and that's just within the last 8-10 years since having to submit work to Temple file, because of the rate of finding names has speeded up we could not just keep trying to do their work ourselves , only three males twice a month. If that's in ten years, what's it going to be like after the next ten years ? , and finding family history will speed up even more as technology makes it even easier and quicker. 

[Jane_Doe]

20 minutes ago, Lehite said:

"First timers" as in ' own' ( live endowment. ) ..living not dead.  Have the full session. The dead probably  have more info on the other side of the vale and are not bound by time, like we are.

A statement without any doctrinal support.  

20 minutes ago, Lehite said:

An average human has only  90 years on earth, a lot spent sleeping, a lot spent working for a living, a lot spent doing family stuff , church stuff, own interests, also maybe looking after someone, in the end there is not much time to do Temple work. 

" inconvenient " is not the problem, .... time is. , or 'lack of it' 

I'm sorry, but this sounds a lot like "I'm too busy, too impatient, and too important to spend equal time doing this person's ordinance."  

20 minutes ago, Lehite said:

Back to the original problem, being a 'bottleneck' at the Temple , finding names is a lot more quicker and easier than it has ever been in history, that side has speeded up considerably. Doing the work for them in the Temple hasn't kept up the the same momentum. 

The endowment has changed and been shortened over the years, till now, when finding ancestors has speeded up but not the endowment. 

Again, ALL the temple work will get done.  We need not be driven by human impatience.  We don't need to skimp on it.  We don't need to short change those who came before us.  

20 minutes ago, Lehite said:

..but that's not for us to say really, we just do and obey, and plod on, "Faith in every footstep" , praying and hoping the Lord will show the prophet what needs to be done, trusting in him, and if that means to carry on as we are fair enough.  Patience, patience,patience,  take your time and do what you can with what time you have, pace yourself and ..sigh. , sorry ancestors, you've waited this long, you can wait a bit longer. Let the bottleneck get bigger. I remember when it used to be only one to  two years waiting time for male endowment Temple file to be done from first submitting them. Now it's well over ten years, ...and that's just within the last 8-10 years since having to submit work to Temple file, because of the rate of finding names has speeded up we could not just keep trying to do their work ourselves , only three males twice a month. If that's in ten years, what's it going to be like after the next ten years ? , and finding family history will speed up even more as technology makes it even easier and quicker. 

Woe unto ark-steadiers...

Edited August 6, 2017 by Jane_Doe

[a mustard seed]

2 hours ago, Lehite said:

The dead .... are not bound by time, like we are.

*snip*

 and ..sigh. , sorry ancestors, you've waited this long, you can wait a bit longer.

Yeah. Uh-huh.

Inconvenience is not the problem.

Edited August 6, 2017 by a mustard seed

[Guest]

I suppose it's what is the most priority in our lives, each individual has their own bag to carry, if it's a life long service in looking after a sick family member, tackling addiction , fulfilling  callings and assignments under load, spending time with family or playing golf. Our time here on earth is ours, what we do with it is up to us. The Temple is a great place to be to 'get away from it all' and get 're-charged',  ...for ourselves, ..to gain that strength to carry on ,  besides doing saving ordinances for ourselves and for our kindred dead,  if you're juggling a load of balls in the air, or got a heavy bag fully loaded, the Temple is a nice place to get things in to an eternal perspective. We need to go often, but the work does need to speed up. It's called Temple  'work' what 'work'is to be done ? It's like president Uchdorfes talk about lifting together, lift that piano together, and the work is easier, maybe if you take the legs off it will lighten it, plan your route where you are carrying it, maybe use wisdom and common sense place the stronger person in the heavier end,use mechanical assistance if possible, there are still ways to make the work quicker and more efficient, but in the end it's up to the Lord. 

I'm learning to be 'patient in perspective' , ...eternal perspective. 

Ive been fasting today on my feelings on this subject, and feel humbled, with a further  reminder that everything is done in order and  "in the Lords time" , and the feeling came to me that maybe we are not yet spiritually ready for further changes to the endowment, when we are not attending the Temple enough as it is. Yes , some stuff does annoy me, ( especially the over dramatic acting in the latest films ,.... that makes it longer ) and some of the ancient ways that women are seen to be as, but I'm going to look beyond the irritant things, and try to think of  the eternal perspective from now on when I attend the Temple. 

Its still not 'my thing' to go to the Temple, but the work still needs to be done, I don't enjoy it , I would much rather do something else that I do enjoy, but if we don't do the work for our ancestors, who will ? If you have a valid up to date recommend, ....use it ! 

[Sunday21]

I am dedicated to the temple! An average convert can easily have 150 names to do. At my current rate of progress which includes begging and pleading others to help me, I will never get all these people processed. I will end up leaving a huge temple file and so will many, many other people. In my area the temple file names currently being processed are from 2013. What to do? 

[Jane_Doe]

2 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

I am dedicated to the temple! An average convert can easily have 150 names to do. At my current rate of progress which includes begging and pleading others to help me, I will never get all these people processed. I will end up leaving a huge temple file and so will many, many other people. In my area the temple file names currently being processed are from 2013. What to do? 

Sunday, *hugs* 

You have many helpers and many years to do all this work.  Don't feel like you need to do it all yourself or all this decade.  Trust in the Lord: His timing and Him providing the help to get all His purposes done.  WE as the KINGDOM of GOD will make sure that every member is taken care of.

Edited August 7, 2017 by Jane_Doe

[Jane_Doe]

3 hours ago, Lehite said:

The Temple is a great place to be to 'get away from it all' and get 're-charged',  ...for ourselves, ..to gain that strength to carry on ,  besides doing saving ordinances for ourselves and for our kindred dead,  if you're juggling a load of balls in the air, or got a heavy bag fully loaded, the Temple is a nice place to get things in to an eternal perspective. We need to go often, but the work does need to speed up. It's called Temple  'work' what 'work'is to be done ? It's like president Uchdorfes talk about lifting together, lift that piano together, and the work is easier, maybe if you take the legs off it will lighten it, plan your route where you are carrying it, maybe use wisdom and common sense place the stronger person in the heavier end,use mechanical assistance if possible, there are still ways to make the work quicker and more efficient, but in the end it's up to the Lord. 

I'm learning to be 'patient in perspective' , ...eternal perspective. 

Ive been fasting today on my feelings on this subject, and feel humbled, with a further  reminder that everything is done in order and  "in the Lords time" , and the feeling came to me that maybe we are not yet spiritually ready for further changes to the endowment, when we are not attending the Temple enough as it is.  Yes , some stuff does annoy me, ( especially the over dramatic acting in the latest films ,.... that makes it longer ) and some of the ancient ways that women are seen to be as, but I'm going to look beyond the irritant things, and try to think of  the eternal perspective from now on when I attend the Temple. 

*Big hugs for sister in Christ*

Also: if it helps to know, the new film is longer with all the pauses because other languages take longer to say things and need that time.  I hear about how it does seem awkward in English, but it does serve a purpose.  

 

3 hours ago, Lehite said:

Its still not 'my thing' to go to the Temple, but the work still needs to be done, I don't enjoy it , I would much rather do something else that I do enjoy, but if we don't do the work for our ancestors, who will ? If you have a valid up to date recommend, ....use it ! 

Another thing I find to be important is remembering that not every person has every gift or "thing".  We each have our place in the kingdom to serve, and not to feel bad that we don't have every gift.  It's by divine design that we are all different and thrive in different areas. 

[Vort]

I love the endowment. Love it. I miss certain elements of the pre-1990 endowment, but I trust our leaders implicitly. I can imagine why the changes were made. I know that the particulars of the endowment have changed greatly from its inception; my mother has mentioned congregational singing as a part of the endowment previous to my era.

On the one hand, some people complain about the length of the endowment. On the other hand, many complain that the Church "tricks" people into making covenants, the depth and import of which the poor fools don't realize until it's far too late. Well, of course you aren't going to understand the ramifications of your actions until you see them played out; that's the nature of our existence. But the endowment presentation does need to make certain elements understood, and I don't see how that is reasonably possible in less than two hours or so.

On the balance, I consider the endowment a work of art on par with the finest and most amazing work I have seen, except the endowment presentation is less about dazzling brilliance and polish, and more about showing deep-rooted divine truths. They can stretch it out to three hours, or four, and I'm okay with that.

(If it makes any difference to anyone, the pre-1990-era endowment was longer, even than the "new" endowment presentations. I have it on excellent authority that the endowment presentation in older eras was longer still. So if you're all uptight about the length of the endowment, you should feel glad it's as short as it is.)

On another note: Several years ago, my wife and I attended a session in the Salt Lake temple. I had not attended a "live actor" session since our wedding, which at the time was 25 years previous. I was emotionally touched, literally almost to tears, at the endowment presentation. It was not theatrical at all, very sober and dignified, with quite a bit of correction of lines going on. For some reason, it touched a deep emotional chord in me. I loved it. I wish every session were like that.

[Vort]

8 hours ago, Lehite said:

The dead probably  have more info on the other side of the vale and are not bound by time, like we are.

I believe the dead are just exactly as bound by time as we are. I think the revelations offer plenty of support for this view.

[Guest]

6 hours ago, Vort said:

I believe the dead are just exactly as bound by time as we are. I think the revelations offer plenty of support for this view.

That's just my thoughts, probably  from reading too many NDE experiences, there are hundreds on line. The best ones are the ones immediately recorded and if the person who had it , had no previous religious background, but just told it as it was and what they felt/saw . Fascinating 

Templ work is slow, and cannot keep up with the names found, and the bottleneck will continue to grow,  it's frustrating . But yeh, hey ho, keep on going, line upon line, steady as she goes. 

[Guest]

On 07/08/2017 at 6:15 AM, Vort said:

 

" On another note: Several years ago, my wife and I attended a session in the Salt Lake temple. I had not attended a "live actor" session since our wedding, which at the time was 25 years previous. I was emotionally touched, literally almost to tears, at the endowment presentation. It was not theatrical at all, very sober and dignified, with quite a bit of correction of lines going on. For some reason, it touched a deep emotional chord in me. I loved it. I wish every session were like that."

I enjoy a 'live session' ,  did one in the Manti Temple and one in the Salt Lake Temple. Both kept me awake and seemed to go quickly. 

Edited August 24, 2017 by Guest