Same sex marriage support

[omegaseamaster75]

Is it possible to support same sex marriage and hold a current temple recommend?

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

Yes. I read that somewhere. I don't have time to look for it right now, but I believe it was a news story reportin something an General Authority had said to a group. 

[Guest MormonGator]

Yes. When I held a temple recommend my Bishop/Stake president both knew my views on same sex marriage. 

[prisonchaplain]

I don't want to wander into the weeds on this, but isn't the Temple Recommend gained primarily by godly living, as opposed to doctrinal knowledge?

[zil]

38 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

I don't want to wander into the weeds on this, but isn't the Temple Recommend gained primarily by godly living, as opposed to doctrinal knowledge?

Expressions of faith and assertions that you are living certain required commandments.

[prisonchaplain]

8 minutes ago, zil said:

Expressions of faith and assertions that you are living certain required commandments.

It seems reasonable. I'm inclined not to let my daughters marry non-tithers. After all, it's bad enough dating a thief--but someone who would rob God???

[prisonchaplain]

10 minutes ago, zil said:

Expressions of faith and assertions that you are living certain required commandments.

I'm still working on my many deficiencies--including my honest and naïve nature.

[Just_A_Guy]

In a variant ripped from today's headlines: Is it possible to support same sex marriage white supremacy and hold a current temple recommend?

The answer to both questions is probably "yes".  But the recommend holder is still colossally, epically wrong.

Edited August 15, 2017 by Just_A_Guy

[Just_A_Guy]

1 hour ago, LiterateParakeet said:

Yes. I read that somewhere. I don't have time to look for it right now, but I believe it was a news story reportin something an General Authority had said to a group. 

I believe Elder Christofferson said that it doesn't constitute "apostasy" justifying loss of Church membership.  See https://www.sixteensmallstones.org/lds-apostle-d-todd-christofferson-on-disagreeing-with-the-church-about-same-sex-marriage/.

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

I found it.

http://archive.sltrib.com/article.php?id=2301174&itype=CMSID

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, LiterateParakeet said:

I found it.

http://archive.sltrib.com/article.php?id=2301174&itype=CMSID

Cue the tune to Rod Stewart's Infatuation:

Oh, no!  Not again.
That's just so wrong.  I don't understand.
The Tribulation.... Ooh.
The Tribulation..

I actually found that article quite enlightening.  It is pretty much what I expected.

[Grunt]

Is it inappropriate to ask how you can be LDS and support same sex marriage?

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, Grunt said:

Is it inappropriate to ask how you can be LDS and support same sex marriage?

Not inappropriate at all.  I ask that all the time.  But I'm afraid a dear friend on this board supports it and... well, what are you going to do?

For my part, I believe it is morally wrong based on what the history of marriage is.  But as a libertarian, I have to say that governments should have no right to tell people whom they can and can't marry.

So, 'support' could be on different levels.  I just wish government got out of the marriage business altogether.  But whatever. The world is not supposed to be this messed up where it is even an issue to support or deny.  People are supposed to be better than this.

[MrShorty]

My thought is a cautious, yes. Semantically, it might depend on exactly what we mean by "support". To draw a parallel, can a good Mormon (perhaps back in 1933) believe that alcohol consumption was morally wrong, but also believe that prohibition is/was bad public policy? To bring out the big guns, what about abortion? Can a good Mormon believe that abortion is morally wrong (with exceptions as frequently noted and for which we sometimes get criticized), but also believe that overturning Roe v. Wade would be bad legislation? Can one believe that SSM is morally wrong, but also support its legalization in the civil arena of a pluralistic society?

[The Folk Prophet]

Supporting same-sex marriage does not equate to believing that such relationships are healthy, good, or positive.

[Grunt]

3 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Not inappropriate at all.  I ask that all the time.  But I'm afraid a dear friend on this board supports it and... well, what are you going to do?

For my part, I believe it is morally wrong based on what the history of marriage is.  But as a libertarian, I have to say that governments should have no right to tell people whom they can and can't marry.

So, 'support' could be on different levels.  I just wish government got out of the marriage business altogether.  But whatever. The world is not supposed to be this messed up where it is even an issue to support or deny.  People are supposed to be better than this.

Thank you.  As a libertarian I'm with you.  However, I don't feel my belief that the government shouldn't be involved in marriage at all equals a support of same sex marriage.  

[Guest MormonGator]

24 minutes ago, Grunt said:

Is it inappropriate to ask how you can be LDS and support same sex marriage?

It's a totally fair question, totally legit. 

I separate my religious and political views. In the secular world, marriage is a private contract between two individuals. The state/a church has no right to tell two individuals who they can and can't marry anymore than a state can tell a church to sanction the marriage of two people of the same gender. 

[Jane_Doe]

1 hour ago, Grunt said:

Is it inappropriate to ask how you can be LDS and support same sex marriage?

I also find a lot of LDS are of the opinion that yes SSM is not God's way, but at the same time those who do SSM should not be legally persecuted or discriminated because of it. 

[mdfxdb]

3 hours ago, omegaseamaster75 said:

Is it possible to support same sex marriage and hold a current temple recommend?

See below temple recommend question:

7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

I would want to reconcile somehow: Is same sex marriage contrary or opposed to teachings or practices of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

Note the word "support" in the question......

[Mike]

3 minutes ago, mdfxdb said:

See below temple recommend question:

7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

I would want to reconcile somehow: Is same sex marriage contrary or opposed to teachings or practices of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

Note the word "support" in the question......

For starters same sex marriage is not a group nor an individual. 

[mdfxdb]

1 minute ago, Mike said:

For starters same sex marriage is not a group nor an individual. 

So do people just get an idea to support same sex marriage all by themselves?  For the same sex marriage supporters, is there just a nebulous decision to support same sex marriage, independently derived from no particular source, or is there a group or individual promoting this?

[Mike]

12 minutes ago, mdfxdb said:

So do people just get an idea to support same sex marriage all by themselves?  For the same sex marriage supporters, is there just a nebulous decision to support same sex marriage, independently derived from no particular source, or is there a group or individual promoting this?

Some may. Perhaps others do not. My remark was meant to draw your attention to the words [in the temple recommend interview] that convey the intent behind the question in the first place. I felt like your post on the other hand tended to expand the question beyond what it is meant to determine. 

Edited August 15, 2017 by Mike

[mdfxdb]

If I believe that 7 year old children should be allowed to smoke and drink, and in fact support that notion, then am I contrary to question 7?

If not, then why not?

If so, then can we categorize same sex marriage as being covered in question 7?

[Mike]

10 minutes ago, mdfxdb said:

If I believe that 7 year old children should be allowed to smoke and drink, and in fact support that notion, then am I contrary to question 7?

If not, then why not?

If so, then can we categorize same sex marriage as being covered in question 7?

You don't believe that, so it's a poor comparison. Let's stick with same-sex marriage.

 

Edited August 15, 2017 by Mike

[JohnsonJones]

4 minutes ago, mdfxdb said:

If I believe that 7 year old children should be allowed to smoke and drink, and in fact support that notion, then am I contrary to question 7?

If not, then why not?

If so, then can we categorize same sex marriage as being covered in question 7?

There's a difference between support and actively promoting.

A default position is one of silence in some situations.  In this situation, if you felt that there should be no age based or other restrictive laws on who can smoke or drink (and in some areas of the world, 7 year olds ARE allowed and DO drink some alcoholic beverages at times), then you may be supportive of that position by default.

However, that is a far cry than going to the elementary school and trying to encourage all the kids to buy alcoholic drinks and smokes from your corner store across from the school and handing out free samples.

In that light, if you think the laws (for example, in regards to LDS history and the persecution of Mormons for polygamy practices) regarding marriage are too restrictive or allow discrimination and persecution based upon what should be one's personal convictions rather than something state owned and sponsored, your default position may be supportive of those who also want the same thing so they can practice Gay Marriage.

On the otherhand, that's a FAR cry than entering into Gay Marriage yourself and promoting it to others as just and right and testifying that anyone who does not think it is the moral and upright thing to do is a bigot.

The first probably is appropriate, the second...well...that's a lot more questionable in regards to the whether you are being honest in your temple recommend questions.