Sí, señor, Seattle sucks


Vort
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34 minutes ago, Vort said:

http://www3.forbes.com/lifestyle/the-most-conservative-and-most-liberal-cities-in-america/19/

Seattle is the third most politically "liberal" city in the US, behind only DC and San Francisco. Wow, who knew?

Thanks.  Very interesting.

Aren't almost all cities liberal - or at least more liberal than the areas surrounding them?

My dad said once (with no small amount of disgust) that almost every county in Washington State was red, except the one that covers most of the Seattle Metro (King)

i guess i'd consider myself a conservative in theory - and middle of the road with liberal leanings in practice.  i think the government does a pretty awful and inefficient job at most social things - but i don't know - seems like someone has to step in when a lot of people play life like my brother used to play a game of Monopoly (hint: he cheated :)  - and was pretty good at it too).  

i wonder what it is about cities that make people more liberal.  i tend to think a person's political leanings are mostly a function of the experiences of their parents, followed by their own experiences - which are often not that different.  

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Guest LiterateParakeet

I love Seattle!   Though I don't like driving in downtown Seattle . . .  ugh.   Space Needle, Freemont Troll, Alcai Beach, Pike Place Market, Pacific Northwest Ballet.....so much to love here!!!!   

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28 minutes ago, lostinwater said:

Aren't almost all cities liberal - or at least more liberal than the areas surrounding them?

Yep.

28 minutes ago, lostinwater said:

My dad said once (with no small amount of disgust) that almost every county in Washington State was red, except the one that covers most of the Seattle Metro (King)

This is true. King County is heavily Democrat, as are a few other counties. But they hold well over 50% of the state's population.

29 minutes ago, lostinwater said:

i guess i'd consider myself a conservative in theory - and middle of the road with liberal leanings in practice.  i think the government does a pretty awful and inefficient job at most social things - but i don't know - seems like someone has to step in when a lot of people play life like my brother used to play a game of Monopoly (hint: he cheated :)  - and was pretty good at it too).

A common misconception is that conservatives want no government. That is false, of course; it's called "anarchy". Conservatives want government to tend to governmental duties, including things like keeping corporations in line. Conservatives aren't much into the idea of forcible redistribution of wealth.

30 minutes ago, lostinwater said:

i wonder what it is about cities that make people more liberal.  i tend to think a person's political leanings are mostly a function of the experiences of their parents, followed by their own experiences - which are often not that different.

I have wondered about this, too. This seems to me to be very clearly an emergent property of cities. You can see that having people living in very close proximity, where they do not produce their own food and think, for example, that milk comes from stores, would result in some certain odd perceptions of reality. The need for infrastructure to support water distribution, sewage collection, public transportation, and other such things requires rewiring of your brain to accept things that normal people would not accept.

Question: Why, then, would ANYONE choose to live in a city?

Answer: Because cities provide experiences and possibilities that cannot be had elsewhere. Again, this is not at all obvious; it's an emergent property of having lots of people living close together. You get more organized crime, more domestic violence, more theft -- but you also get other things. Music. Arts. Engineering. Libraries. Ultimately, you get civilization, the root word of which means "city".

New Yorkers think they're smarter than everyone else. No, seriously. They honestly believe they are much smarter than anyone else, and specifically much smarter than those who live in what they dismissively refer to as "flyover country". It is exactly this unmitigated hubris that forms the greatest Achilles' heel of city folk, and probably that leads to their downfall. But when you have the strange, seemingly magical advantages that cities can provide, it becomes easy to overlook your own idiocy and start believing that you really are intrinsically superior to everyone else, not just intellectually but morally.

Behold the modern American "liberal" Democrat party!

It's a shame, too. One day, probably not in this life, we will live in Zion, a city beyond compare. We will enjoy all of the weird, magical emergent advantages of a city, but without the crippling hubris and foolishness that dogs the Democrat Party and American so-called "liberals" in general. Until then, I'm not sure how to deal with the inevitable moral decay that cities always bring. We can't live (at least not in health and beauty) with cities, but in our modern society, we literally can't live without them. Not sure how to resolve that Catch-22.

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27 minutes ago, LiterateParakeet said:

I love Seattle!   Though I don't like driving in downtown Seattle . . .  ugh.   Space Needle, Freemont Troll, Alcai Beach, Pike Place Market, Pacific Northwest Ballet.....so much to love here!!!!   

Yes!

And the hikes, mild temps, summers, air, and ferries!

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20 minutes ago, Vort said:

Question: Why, then, would ANYONE choose to live in a city?

Answer: Because cities provide experiences and possibilities that cannot be had elsewhere. Again, this is not at all obvious; it's an emergent property of having lots of people living close together. You get more organized crime, more domestic violence, more theft -- but you also get other things. Music. Arts. Engineering. Libraries. Ultimately, you get civilization, the root word of which means "city".

i might just plagiarize this when my friends ask me why in the world i would choose to live in a city.  :)   It's perfect.

And also, you can sort of blend in - be invisible when you want to - and re-define yourself when you need to.

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11 hours ago, Vort said:

http://www3.forbes.com/lifestyle/the-most-conservative-and-most-liberal-cities-in-america/19/

Seattle is the third most politically "liberal" city in the US, behind only DC and San Francisco. Wow, who knew?

http://www3.forbes.com/lifestyle/the-most-conservative-and-most-liberal-cities-in-america/2/

How on earth did Aurora, Co get on the list of "most conservative"?  It ranked #10.  They typically vote for Democrats for house and most of the state legislature candidates as well.  Their current mayor is Republican, but he switched sides.  And some of the ordinances he's passed?  

And Salt Lake City didn't even make the list.

Edited by Guest
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Guest MormonGator
10 hours ago, lostinwater said:

Aren't almost all cities liberal - 

Yup. 

 

9 hours ago, Vort said:

New Yorkers think they're smarter than everyone else

Yes, but in reality NYC is the financial capital of the world, so those who live in NYC are among the best and the brightest people in the world. That doesn't mean that they have the right to tell you how to live of course. 

 

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12 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

And Salt Lake City didn't even make the list.

I'm sure the rest of Utah considers Salt Lake City to be as liberal as Berkeley! 

Edited by MormonGator
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Guest MormonGator

Something else to remember is that many people in NYC/Boston/Philly/DC don't think of themselves as liberal, but as moderate. It's just "enlightened thinking" to be pro choice, against guns, pro gay marriage and pro taxation. After all, all my friends think that way. The New York Times thinks that way. "Liberals" are just those who are vocal and radical about it. But me and my friends? No, we're just reasonable and moderate. "Conservatives" are hicks from small towns. Most of my friends from up north live in big cities (Boston, NYC) and even though they are socially liberal, they all consider themselves moderate.

Edited by MormonGator
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8 hours ago, MormonGator said:

Something else to remember is that many people in NYC/Boston/Philly/DC don't think of themselves as liberal, but as moderate. It's just "enlightened thinking" to be pro choice, against guns, pro gay marriage and pro taxation. After all, all my friends think that way. The New York Times thinks that way. "Liberals" are just those who are vocal and radical about it. But me and my friends? No, we're just reasonable and moderate. "Conservatives" are hicks from small towns. Most of my friends from up north live in big cities (Boston, NYC) and even though they are socially liberal, they all consider themselves moderate.

You guys are mean! 😪

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Guest MormonGator
1 hour ago, Sunday21 said:

Some liberals, ahem, are lovely people. You might like them. 

I never said otherwise-many of my closest friends including my brother swing to the left. I'm still totally lost about this @Sunday21

Edited by MormonGator
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21 hours ago, Vort said:

http://www3.forbes.com/lifestyle/the-most-conservative-and-most-liberal-cities-in-america/19/

Seattle is the third most politically "liberal" city in the US, behind only DC and San Francisco. Wow, who knew?

Those of us who live here are beyond unsurprised . . . especially, @Vort!

Edited by prisonchaplain
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20 hours ago, LiterateParakeet said:

I love Seattle!   Though I don't like driving in downtown Seattle . . .  ugh.   Space Needle, Freemont Troll, Alcai Beach, Pike Place Market, Pacific Northwest Ballet.....so much to love here!!!!   

Coffee's not too bad either...oh wait, wrong site...never mind! :P

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10 hours ago, Carborendum said:

How on earth did Aurora, Co get on the list of "most conservative"?  It ranked #10. 

It's the home of the National Corrections Academy, and these days anything related to law enforcement is considered conservative. How sad is that!!! :(

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Guest MormonGator
7 minutes ago, Vort said:

I don't think MG meant to suggest otherwise.

Correct. I'm lost over this, I've re-read my post a few times and I'm not sure how it could be taken in a negative way at all. 

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34 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Correct. I'm lost over this, I've re-read my post a few times and I'm not sure how it could be taken in a negative way at all. 

The terms conservative and liberal now have become so politically charged.  You hear both groups referring to the other as if they are the minions of the devil - and despite knowing this, purposefully participate in it.  i have to catch and remind myself sometimes when i hear someone who sees something different refer to me with label X/Y/Z that nothing is meant by it.

It's sort of scary all the divisiveness between conservatives and liberals these days - i sometimes think that a large wobble of our economy will be enough to set our whole hate and fear drenched political system ablaze.  Conservatives and liberals both hold very valid viewpoints - and both need the balance the other provides (my opinion).  Perfection lies in working together - not in one ideology dominating the other. 

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Guest MormonGator
10 hours ago, lostinwater said:

The terms conservative and liberal now have become so politically charged.  You hear both groups referring to the other as if they are the minions of the devil - and despite knowing this, purposefully participate in it.  i have to catch and remind myself sometimes when i hear someone who sees something different refer to me with label X/Y/Z that nothing is meant by it.

It's sort of scary all the divisiveness between conservatives and liberals these days - i sometimes think that a large wobble of our economy will be enough to set our whole hate and fear drenched political system ablaze.  Conservatives and liberals both hold very valid viewpoints - and both need the balance the other provides (my opinion).  Perfection lies in working together - not in one ideology dominating the other. 

All  true. 

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