My Bishop took my temple recommend away unfairly. How can I contest his decision?

[JayKi]

59 minutes ago, Sunday21 said:

I feel for you! Would I be correct in thinking that you live in a city with only one ward? If so, you may be interacting with this bishop in order to get your temple recommend for awhile. So...it might be an idea to treat him gently. I am very polite and respectful to church leaders because...temple recommend!  I don’t know about where you live but here, you cannot get an appointment with the stake president if you are not scheduled for a recommend interview even if you have a stake calling so...you may have to walk gently

There are a few wards near me. I am respectful but I think there is a little xenophobia in the congregation I go to. 

[omegaseamaster75]

Just now, JayKi said:

I can be friends with married women! We get on well and I care about her I shouldn't stop just because she is married. If her husband is insecure about her speaking to male friends then that is his problem for him to work through. Also, I am not single I have a girlfriend and I am getting married soon. 

You can be friend with married women sure, as long as it's a hi how are up you? or getting invited over for dinner with your girlfriend.  

Men and women cannot be friends in the traditional sense of friendship. (there are exceptions) but it requires more maturity and understanding than most people are capable of. If her husband is uncomfortable with the friendship you need to knock it off.  Unless you value your friendship with her more than the sanctity of her marriage.

[JayKi]

1 hour ago, MormonGator said:

haven't seen the words yet either, but one thing I've noticed about some LDS (Key word, some) is they have a very hard time understanding that a male and female can be friends. I could text my female friend "Happy Birthday!" and some (again, some) LDS would automatically think that's wrong, flirtatious or inappropriate. So he might have a point with this one about the congregation/bishop being a bit over sensitive. 

Most of my friends are women because I only grew up with women I have 4 sister, my mother and grandmother so I always had women for friends. I prefer it to male friends because I am not much of a lad. 

[Grunt]

1 hour ago, MormonGator said:

I haven't seen the words yet either, but one thing I've noticed about some LDS (Key word, some) is they have a very hard time understanding that a male and female can be friends. I could text my female friend "Happy Birthday!" and some (again, some) LDS would automatically think that's wrong, flirtatious or inappropriate. So he might have a point with this one about the congregation/bishop being a bit over sensitive. 

So true.  I don't mind at all, but there are families I'm close to and when the women text me for something specific they always add my wife on the text.

[JayKi]

2 minutes ago, omegaseamaster75 said:

You can be friend with married women sure, as long as it's a hi how are up you? or getting invited over for dinner with your girlfriend.  

Men and women cannot be friends in the traditional sense of friendship. (there are exceptions) but it requires more maturity and understanding than most people are capable of. If her husband is uncomfortable with the friendship you need to knock it off.  Unless you value your friendship with her more than the sanctity of her marriage.

I think it is okay we only go for lunch together or to the cinema, sometimes shopping. We don't hang out in private places most of the time. Her husband should get over it, she can be friends with who she choose, he can't control her life. 

[Guest MormonGator]

1 minute ago, JayKi said:

Most of my friends are women because I only grew up with women I have 4 sister, my mother and grandmother so I always had women for friends. I prefer it to male friends because I am not much of a lad. 

I'm in your corner on this one bro,100%. One of my closest friends in the world is a :: gasp :: single woman. I've known her for over a decade and we :: oh no :: text easily once a every few days. We also chat on FB messenger and we've grabbed lunch at cafes too. Ladygator knows this and doesn't care at all.

[Grunt]

8 minutes ago, JayKi said:

I can be friends with married women! We get on well and I care about her I shouldn't stop just because she is married. If her husband is insecure about her speaking to male friends then that is his problem for him to work through. Also, I am not single I have a girlfriend and I am getting married soon. 

While that may be true technically, you should be very cautious with how you interact with women.  You don't want to cause issues in their minds or relationships "just because you can".

[Guest MormonGator]

3 minutes ago, Grunt said:

So true.  I don't mind at all, but there are families I'm close to and when the women text me for something specific they always add my wife on the text.

That's the key right there. My friend (her name is Jen) is also friends with LadyGator. As long as you aren't being inappropriate, there is nothing wrong whatsoever. 

Sure, don't be stupid. My friend and I don't check into hotels together or hold hands during dinner-but if you use common sense, you'll be fine. 

Edited April 24, 2018 by MormonGator

[Grunt]

1 minute ago, JayKi said:

I think it is okay we only go for lunch together or to the cinema, sometimes shopping. We don't hang out in private places most of the time. Her husband should get over it, she can be friends with who she choose, he can't control her life. 

This attitude really disturbs me.  Thankfully, I don't have to worry about this with my spouse, but you and I would certainly be sitting down for a chat if you were taking my wife to the movies and lunch.

[Midwest LDS]

1 minute ago, MormonGator said:

I'm in your corner on this one bro,100%. One of my closest friends in the world is a :: gasp :: single woman. I've known her for over a decade and we :: oh no :: text easily once a every few days. We also chat on FB messenger and we've grabbed lunch at cafes too. Ladygator knows this and doesn't care at all.

I agree with you, especially since your wife is aware of anything you are doing with her. That's the key, as the problem only arises, in my mind, when you start having meetings or texting another woman without letting your wife know. If you have to keep it secret, it's wrong.

[omegaseamaster75]

1 minute ago, JayKi said:

I think it is okay we only go for lunch together or to the cinema, sometimes shopping. We don't hang out in private places most of the time. Her husband should get over it, she can be friends with who she choose, he can't control her life. 

Baring the exceptions @MormonGator I would have a problem with my wife going to lunch or the movies with her single friend.  There are thing that are and are not appropriate. 

[JayKi]

1 minute ago, Grunt said:

This attitude really disturbs me.  Thankfully, I don't have to worry about this with my spouse, but you and I would certainly be sitting down for a chat if you were taking my wife to the movies and lunch.

Why? We are friends what is the problem? If you trust your wife there is nothing to worry for

[NeuroTypical]

5 minutes ago, JayKi said:

I think it is okay we only go for lunch together or to the cinema, sometimes shopping. We don't hang out in private places most of the time. Her husband should get over it, she can be friends with who she choose, he can't control her life. 

So you date married women, including going private places sometimes.  And then you flip out when a bishop takes away your temple recommend.  

News flash JayKi - your bishop isn't acting out of spite and jealousy and bitterness.  He's trying to get you to change your destructive marriage-destroying ways. 

JayKi - you are doing wrong.  Whatever was acceptable in whatever culture you come from, that stuff doesn't fly here.

JayKi, humble yourself and repent.

Edited April 24, 2018 by NeuroTypical

[Guest MormonGator]

Just now, Midwest LDS said:

I agree with you, especially since your wife is aware of anything you are doing with her. That's the key, as the problem only arises, in my mind, when you start having meetings or texting another woman without letting your wife know. If you have to keep it secret, it's wrong.

Agree 100%. Communication is key. Tell your significant other everything and be honest and open with them. If you do that, you are fine. 

1 minute ago, omegaseamaster75 said:

Baring the exceptions @MormonGator I would have a problem with my wife going to lunch or the movies with her single friend.  There are thing that are and are not appropriate. 

 You have every right whatsoever to set the ground rules in your own marriage that you and your spouse are both comfortable with. @omegaseamaster75 does not have to live by the same rules as @MormonGator

[omegaseamaster75]

@mormongator

[Vort]

7 minutes ago, JayKi said:

I think it is okay we only go for lunch together or to the cinema, sometimes shopping. We don't hang out in private places most of the time. Her husband should get over it, she can be friends with who she choose, he can't control her life. 

DANGER, WILL ROBINSON!!!!

[JayKi]

1 minute ago, NeuroTypical said:

So you date married women, including going private places some times.  And then you flip out when a bishop takes away your temple recommend.  

News flash JayKi - your bishop isn't acting out of spite and jealousy and bitterness.  He's trying to get you to change your destructive marriage-destroying ways. 

JayKi - you are doing wrong.  Whatever was acceptable in whatever culture you come from, that stuff doesn't fly here.

JayKi, humble yourself and repent.

No we are only friend I have only friendship feeling toward her. I did nothing wrong and neither did she. Is not fair just because she is a woman we can't be friend. 

[omegaseamaster75]

@MormonGator has it nailed down, are you close friends with her husband? was this a long standing friendship that preceded their marriage? Are you respecting his wishes? 

Edited April 24, 2018 by omegaseamaster75

[omegaseamaster75]

......................

Edited April 24, 2018 by omegaseamaster75

[Vort]

1 minute ago, JayKi said:

No we are only friend I have only friendship feeling toward her. I did nothing wrong and neither did she. Is not fair just because she is a woman we can't be friend. 

Friend, different cultures have different norms. Perhaps what you are doing makes sense in your culture. In American LDS culture, there is no way it's appropriate for an adult man to go out on a casual date with a married woman (who's not married to him and who's not his sister or other relative). Whether it's worth taking away a temple recommend is perhaps debatable, but what's not debatable is that such behavior is well outside the acceptable norms of Anglo LDS behavior.

[Grunt]

7 minutes ago, JayKi said:

Why? We are friends what is the problem? If you trust your wife there is nothing to worry for

The problem sounds like you are engaging in a relationship with a married woman that the husband doesn't support.  This will strain any marriage.  You are either willfully or ignorantly causing issues in someone's family.

[JayKi]

2 minutes ago, omegaseamaster75 said:

@MormonGator has it nailed down, are you close friends with her husband? was this a long standing friendship that preceded their marriage? Are you respecting his wishes? 

No we aren't close because we have some differences. We are very close before she was married because she is from Nicaragua and we bond over that, we used to celebrate festivals we celebrate back home and cook national dish for each other, she my best friend in England but we only ever friend. I respect his wish a little bit but I respect hers more, she is not his property so her opinion to me is what I care about. 

[Guest]

28 minutes ago, JayKi said:

I wanted to cheer her up so I sent her, "It will be okay Princessa, be happy you have a beautiful smile". I only see it can be flirtatious because I may send it to my girlfriend but also to my mother or grandmother or sister.  

25 minutes ago, JayKi said:

I can be friends with married women! We get on well and I care about her I shouldn't stop just because she is married. If her husband is insecure about her speaking to male friends then that is his problem for him to work through. Also, I am not single I have a girlfriend and I am getting married soon. 

And how well do you know her husband?

 

[JayKi]

3 minutes ago, Vort said:

Friend, different cultures have different norms. Perhaps what you are doing makes sense in your culture. In American LDS culture, there is no way it's appropriate for an adult man to go out on a casual date with a married woman (who's not married to him and who's not his sister or other relative). Whether it's worth taking away a temple recommend is perhaps debatable, but what's not debatable is that such behavior is well outside the acceptable norms of Anglo LDS behavior.

It isn't a date. It is just hanging out like if I went out with a male friend. 

[NeuroTypical]

11 minutes ago, JayKi said:

I think it is okay we only go for lunch together or to the cinema, sometimes shopping. We don't hang out in private places most of the time. Her husband should get over it, she can be friends with who she choose, he can't control her life. 

I believe I have enough information to answer your original questions.

I made an appointment to see my stake President in a few days, do you think he will be fair? Or will he side with the Bishop? 

I believe he will be fair, and I believe he will side with the bishop.  When you date married women against the specific objection of her husband, even though you "only have friendship feeling", that is a sinful, horrible thing to do.  You are sinning and could be destroying their marraige.  And you stomp your foot and demand you are right and everyone else is wrong.  You are caught up in the sin of pride, and I would bet ten bucks your SP will tell you the same things your bishop has told you.

Do you know the general process? 

You meet with the SP.  He will probably tell you the same thing the bishop has told you.  You have continual opportunities to humble yourself and stop dating married women against their husband's wishes.  Stop flirting with them in texts too.  Or, you can remain hard, prideful, demanding that you are doing nothing wrong, and you won't have your temple recommend.  That's the process.  

Will the stake President have the final say? 

I think the bishop had the final say here, and the SP will echo his words. 

Do I just need to get him on board or is it more complicated than that ?  

I do not believe you will be able to get any priesthood leader "on board" with your notion that you should be able to date whoever you want and their husbands should just get over it because you're just friends.