Tithing?

[Heckya]

I have a question about tithing. My husband is not a member, but I am and am working towards being an active member again...it's a work in progress.

Anyhow, I am a stay at home mom so I don't make an income. Do I have to pay tithing? It's not that I wouldn't but my husband disagrees with tithing...well, not so much with tithing, but with how closely the lds faith tracks what you give. He thinks those types of things should be between you and God, not an accountant. In fact, the requirement to pay tithing and how it is monitored is what bothers him most about the lds faith. I didn't know it was tracked so closely. I figured he had heard that from someone who was anti mormon. I'm quite surprised by it and somewhat bothered.

Anyhow, my question is will I need to pay tithing?

Thanks.

[Jbs2763]

from my understanding the reason they track it is for tax purposes, non-profits have to keep track of pretty much every dime, and they give you a statement for you taxes at the end of the year

[Heckya]

Taxes-well, you really can't complain about that, can you? Every little deduction helps.

My husband had heard that the church wants a copy of your W-2 to ensure you are paying your full 10%. I've never paid tithing before, but I can't believe that is true. It sounds like anti mormon rumors, at least I sure hope it is.

[BenRaines]

Since you have no income or increase then you have no tithing to pay. Check with your Bishop but I know that members who have spouses who are not LDS can be considered full tithe payors with no income, exempt.

Ben Raines

[inthearmsofsleep]

Also, the church keeps track of tithing to ensure that the money is getting into the right hands. If you know how much you paid and then you get your tithing settlement paper and it says you haven't paid any, then you know something's wrong. I've never been asked to provide a copy of my W-2... and I've never heard of anybody else having to do that either. As far as I know, that's just yet another anti-mormon rumor.

[Mahonri]

Any bishop who is asking for a copy of a W-2 is out of line.

I've known quite a number of women who are in your situation.

I know of one sister who received an allowance from her non-member hubby to make purchases around the home. She said she wanted to give back 10% of that just for the blessings and her husband didn't have a problem with that.

She was always very active and didn't have a job and as her bishop back then, I always considered her the giver of a full tithe.

[WillowTheWhisp]

In all my years in the church I have never been asked for proof of income when attending tithing settlement. My Bishop just asks if I'm a full tithe payer and I say 'yes'. He then shows me the record of what the church acknowledges as having received from me so that I can check up on the church, not the church check up on me. It's so that I can see that everything I have paid in has been received and none gone astray.

There was one time when something did go astray, or at least didn't show up on my tithing settlement and we worried about what on earth could have happened to it. I later discovered the envelope had slipped down behind a fire surround and got lodged between it and the wall. It had never been opened. Once discovered, that was added to my current tithing and all was well. It didn't stop me being classed as a full tithe payer but it did show how important it was to check up on these things.

I am currently married to a non-member and do not pay tithing on his income, only on mine.

[ctr_tanc]

When you go in for tithing settlement and the Bishop asks "are you a full tithe payer," that is the only time that you will ever be "checked up on" by the church, and that's as far as they go. They don't ever check your bank book to see if your paying in full and the only way that they EVER will know if you are paying in full is if you tell them "yes, I am a full tithe-payer." Yes, the church needs to keep a VERY close eye on every cent that comes to it because money that goes to the church is the Lord's money. The accountants of the church are accountants of the Lord. They want to make sure that every penny is accounted for and sent to the cause that it needs to be sent to. NONE of them know if you are a full tithe payer, and in truth, none of them care beyond hoping that you are. The only people who do know are you and your Bishop. He will give you a list of what the church has received from you so that you can check up on the church and make sure that THEY have it right. Nobody is "checking up" on you to make sure that you do pay your tithing and nobody will force you. If you tell your Bishop that you don't pay a full tithe, he'll talk to you about it and he'll encourage you to, but he'll never force you to. Don't worry, Tithing is personal. It's between you, the Lord and your Bishop. Talk to your Bishop and ask him what you should do about your situation, he's given revelation and guidance to deal with complications like these and he'll help you pay the right amount for tithing. Just because one thing is right for someone else doesn't mean that it's the right solution for you. Your bishop will help you find the right solution for you. The Lord asks no more and no less than %10.

[Heckya]

Thanks for the posts and clarification. It gives me a better sense of tithing and reassures me that it is a personal thing. Once we are settled into our ward, I will talk to my bishop about the situation. Thanks again.

[pushka]

Since I was baptised last weekend, the issue of Tithing has been at the forefront of my mind. I asked the Missionaries (the Elders from abroad and the local Ward Missionaries) about my situation of being on Income Support, and whether or not I would be eligible for a Temple Recommend if I didn't pay a full Tithe on my income, and I also asked my Home Teachers about it, they all gave vague replies that it wasn't forced, however any income received into the family was an increase on nothing, and therefore a full tithe ought to be paid on it...I mentioned that it had been suggested to me that I should ask the Bishop about it, but nobody seemed to want to tell me to try that or not..I just got an overwhelming feeling from them all that I ought to class my benefit money as a normal income and therefore decide for myself whether or not to pay a full tithe...I do get the feeling that if I waited till the 1st Tithing Settlement meeting before seeking advice from the Bishop, I might find myself being refused a Temple Recommend if I didn't pay tithes for the next 12 months or so...It's difficult for me to decide whether or not to ask for a meeting with the Bishop about the issue because of people telling me that the Bishop should only be consulted when all other options have failed to deal with your inquiries...

Please, anybody who's been a Bishop or is one now, what have you told your members if they've asked you about a situation like mine?

[Silver Girl]

My husband is a Ward Clerk, and I can assure you that the Church does NOT ask for your W-2... The only record of how much you give is kept by the Clerk so he may prepare a donation statement for you to use for your taxes... I know, because we just split our Ward, and my poor hubby had to get all the donation statements out before the split so we had them before tax season...

And if you have no income, and pay no tithing because you have no income, you are a full tithe payer...

Hopes this helps!!

Silver Girl

[cgrantreed]

It's difficult for me to decide whether or not to ask for a meeting with the Bishop about the issue because of people telling me that the Bishop should only be consulted when all other options have failed to deal with your inquiries...

That is not the way ot works. The Bishop is in charge of the welfare of his ward and its his DUTY to minister to those who are in his ward. NEVER EVER be concerned with asking him ANYTHING. Thats what he is there for. I have never heard anyone say that you had to "get the answers from someone else first".

As far as tithing goes... If you are receiving money for specific purposes like rent, utilities, food... I was told in that position that its NOT to be tithed from. Its not an increase, its a stipend to allow you to live. If the state found out that you were paying tithing off of it, they'd either lower your amount because "you apparently didn't need that much" or they would cut you off completely. I was also told that if I received a "blanket" amount to do whatever i needed to take care of myself (SSI) and it was enough to pay for my needs and there was extra that the "extra" amount could be considered an increase and that i could tithe off of that if I had money to do so. I was able to get back on track in my life and that wasn't an issue anymore but i did not tithe off the amounts that they specifically gave me for covering bills and what not.

The law of tithing is not really to be interpreted by anyone but you. The rule is that if its an increase...something that you did not have before... then its supposed to be tithed off of. If you have been "given" this for a specific purpose... lets not use assistance for an example... Lets say that you had a bill that needed to be paid and a friend handed you a check for the amount that was needed and told you to pay the bill. You would not tithe off of that but would pay the bill. If you had an increase that allowed you to later pay the tithe for that gift then you would just out of obedience and gratitude for the gift. Sometimes that is how the blessings of tithing works... gifts just happen. you could also pay the tithe for that by passing on a "gift" to someone else in service or whatever they needed that you could provide. Its not always monetary...

If you tithe off stuff that was given to you for a specific purpose its like looking a gift horse in the mouth:D I was told by my Bishop that instead of tithing in cash for the amounts that the state was giving me for essentials that we should do service to others to pay God back for the blessing that the state was providing. We did so and when we went into the Bishops office for our tithing settlement he asked me " Are you a full tithe payer?" and I could honestly answer that I was. I could not give the money to God but i could give of something better and that was all I had...so I served instead. Its not a good excuse to not pay the cash if you have it to spare but if you don't... God understands a dedicated effort to pay Him back in other ways. Your Temple recommend is the same way. He doesn't want a detailed description of what you made, he wants to simply know if (between you and GOD) you paid what you owed Him. If you can honestly say yes and KNOW in your heart that you gave your best effort then you are a full tithe payer. Honesty and truth are the two key parts of worthiness.

Now... I have to caution you... be real careful of where that line is as to when you "can't afford to tithe". If you can do so in any way, shape or form then do so. Not for your Bishop but for yourself. I have a strong testimony of this. I decided that one month I was not going to pay tithing so that I could pay a bill and my finances fell all apart. Then a couple months later i figured that i could not afford to NOT pay it and I did and the money for the bills ended up coming 10 fold. He will bless you for sacrificing for Him.

[pushka]

Thank You Cgrantreed, that really was a useful post for my situation. The reason I mentioned about my caution on arranging a meeting with the Bishop was because my Home Teacher said that if I had any sort of problems at all, the Home Teachers should be my 1st port of call, and that I should only call on the Bishop if the HT (or other relevant person I assume, depending on the circumstances) could not deal with my enquiry so that I felt satisfied with the advice I was given.

I'm not trying to get out of tithing completely, I just was afraid after reading in another thread about the way the Govt. would respond if they found I was donating 10% of my total Soc.Security benefits to the church..I wouldn't like to have my benefits reduced because of this.

Your advice regarding using 10% of any increase from my soc.security, after paying necessary bills/shopping needs etc. is really helpful to me, I would gladly try to budget so that I'm using my benefit money wisely and tithe off any spare cash I have after budgeting.

Thank you again :)

[VoluntaryPrison]

I just want to act as a voice of moderation. so far, the best thing I've heard said in this thread is " The law of tithing is not really to be interpreted by anyone but you," and other similar remarks. The only other person who really has the authority to judge if your interpretation is correct (meaning appropriate to your situation) is the Bishop (although any person conducting a temple recommend interview may be required to judge the truthfulness of your claim to be a full tithe payer). If you're unsure about how you should pay (or not pay) tithing in your situation, you should talk to the Bishop, and your home teachers should tell you that.

[Latter Days Guy]

I've also got a question about tithing. What would happen if a church members partner was not a member of the church, has no interest/anti the church and disagrees with the paying of tithes to the church. Should the member go against his partners wishes in regards to paying tithes no matter what the conseqences?

My wife is not a member of the church, she is very anti LDS and we have had a rough time since I returned to the church. The one area that we have the hardest time getting over is tithing. We are not that well off finacially, have a large morgage and two kids to bring up and she sees the ammount of money that I pay as tithes could be put to better use like paying off our debts, utility bills etc first before giving a large chunk of our limited resources to a church she does not support or believe in. What do you think is the solution to a situation like this?

[inthearmsofsleep]

I've also got a question about tithing. What would happen if a church members partner was not a member of the church, has no interest/anti the church and disagrees with the paying of tithes to the church. Should the member go against his partners wishes in regards to paying tithes no matter what the conseqences?

My wife is not a member of the church, she is very anti LDS and we have had a rough time since I returned to the church. The one area that we have the hardest time getting over is tithing. We are not that well off finacially, have a large morgage and two kids to bring up and she sees the ammount of money that I pay as tithes could be put to better use like paying off our debts, utility bills etc first before giving a large chunk of our limited resources to a church she does not support or believe in. What do you think is the solution to a situation like this?

I think this is really a question for your Bishop, and I'm not sure of your/your wife's working situation... but my advice would be that you should pay tithing on what you earn, and she wouldn't pay tithing on what she earns. If you're supporting the whole family, and you want to obey the law of tithing, you should. That's just my opinion, but your Bishop might tell you that family is more important and you and her should come to an agreement on this issue.

[cgrantreed]

I've also got a question about tithing. What would happen if a church members partner was not a member of the church, has no interest/anti the church and disagrees with the paying of tithes to the church. Should the member go against his partners wishes in regards to paying tithes no matter what the conseqences?

My wife is not a member of the church, she is very anti LDS and we have had a rough time since I returned to the church. The one area that we have the hardest time getting over is tithing. We are not that well off finacially, have a large morgage and two kids to bring up and she sees the ammount of money that I pay as tithes could be put to better use like paying off our debts, utility bills etc first before giving a large chunk of our limited resources to a church she does not support or believe in. What do you think is the solution to a situation like this?

Hmmm Smells like Dill. YOU are in a pickle my friend. As posted here before... the answer to that question is "Talk to your Bishop". I can tell you that the law of tithing is pretty clear...Pay 10% of your increase...plain and simple. Your situation is tough because it pits you and your wife against each other in a beliefs/faith argument. To be doing what will qualify you for worthiness (priesthood/temple) tithing is not optional and I am sure your Bishop will tell you as such. I have heard that before. My friend was in the same exact position and he wanted to go to the temple and his wife refused to let him pay tithing on his income. They ended up divorced because he chose God over her. I have no easy answer. BTW... this is why the church talks so heavily about marrying within the same faith. It just keeps the fights down. Doesn't fix the problem of when people change their faiths after marriage though. Sorry i could not be more help.

[Latter Days Guy]

It is a very difficult decision as she sees it as wasted money that could go to better use, I obviously see it as my comitment to the Gospel principle of giving a tithe. Yes at times (well most of the time) we struggle with finances but we have not failed to pay our bills etc. We also have the added pressure of an uncertain future in regards to my wifes job, she works in a bank that has just been taken over by the goverment and the future is looking pretty bad as they will probably lay off a load of staff to help them balance the books before they are sold on again to the highest bidder.

Are there other ways to pay tithes other than with money, could you tithe your time by doing work for the church for example?

[Iggy]

Are there other ways to pay tithes other than with money, could you tithe your time by doing work for the church for example?

Talk with your Bishop about your tithing situation. Ultimately it is his decision.

[Latter Days Guy]

Talk with your Bishop about your tithing situation. Ultimately it is his decision.

I have no problem myself with paying a tithe, I was just asking the question about other ways of making up your tithe to stimulate a discussion on it.

[Iggy]

I have no problem myself with paying a tithe, I was just asking the question about other ways of making up your tithe to stimulate a discussion on it.

It would have to be a discussion for suggestions to take to the Bishop, because, ultimately it is his decision.

My Branch President (same thing as Bishop) allowed me to do a month of "work equity" in lieu of cash tithing. I helped a widowed sister in getting her home cleaned and packing up junk she had collected over the 50 years she had been married.

Is your state a community property state? Then perhaps a compromise with your wife could be you pay tithe on half of your wages. Then you could discuss with your Bishop if you could do "work tithe" for the other half of your wages.

It would be so much easier if you were the LDS wife who is married to the non-member, you just wouldn't pay tithe. Though I know of three women in the church who take in sewing, ironing and who teach piano lessons at home to earn tithing money. The sister who takes in sewing, tithes all the money she earns. She does this to cover her husbands wages. I admire all three of these women- they don't flaunt their tithing in front of their husbands either, which is yet another thing I admire them for.

There is a young couple in my Ward who were having a hard time financially. Then she got pregnant. The few dollars extra at the end of the paycheck was now non-existent due to her Dr bills. They went to the Bishop and he told them to pay the tithing, pay their bills and the Church would supply the food and personal hygiene items. Then she discovered that there were people out there who would pay to have her embroider designs on their clothes. Hand embroider- not by machine. She took special orders and supplemented their income. Within two months they were back on their feet, and tucking away a little extra money for the baby.

So- can you work an extra part time job- or turn a hobby into a paying venture? My father knitted- he taught us kids (my brother too) how to. He also taught us how to darn. I never did it well- but I know how to do it and have done it to the three pair of homemade woolen socks that I have. My father also taught us how to remove collars and cuffs and turn them so they looked new, and he taught me how to embroider. I used to embroider beautiful designs on muslin dish towels, pillow cases, pinafores, aprons, place mats, table streamers, blouses and shirts, hankies, etc.

I don't have many suggestions for men - not being one myself. Brothers, do you have any suggestions?